Re: Benefits of streamlining Happy New Year

Jim Patillo

Morning Clive,

I realized after sending that email yesterday, I should have curbed it. It's been rainin' too much around here and we're all gettin' cabin fever.

Every one and I mean everyone has a right to do as they please, so long as it doesn't harm anyone else. I've always followed the plan that "if it works well, don't reinvent it, copy and improve. I only reinvent when no one has the answer. Sorry if I came across "ansy".

I wish you the very best in this coming year. Do you have a web site or some place I can see your plane?

Jim Patillo

P.S. Tried to commit flying yesterday but the weather god wasn't working with me.

--- In Q-LIST@..., "Clive" <gobxoy@...> wrote:


No need to get so ansy.
I made it quite clear I was talking aero, and you brought in ground handling, in my book they are two different things.
Your happy with your show plane, I'm happy with my "backyard special" and if you think I have any dangley bits, you are mistaken.
Each to their own.
Flying as soon as I can.

--- In Q-LIST@..., "Jim P" <logistics_engineering@> wrote:

Happy New Year Clive,

I'm not confusing anything aero or othewize, please reread my email. As soon as anyone demonstrates they can consistantly cruise their Q at 200 MPH + I'll be all over it. BTW, the JimBob Six Pack has proven itself over and over for many years now. At this stage, people either get it or they don't. So you can dangle what ever you want from the back and its OK.

You are correct, my plane weighs 775 lbs. If you ever saw it up close and personal you would understand why. I built it with the intention of having a fast, clean looking show plane and that's what I got. I wanted a production looking airplane, not one that looked like it was hatched in a back yard. In retrospect, I would have done it the same way.

Best regards and now.............. go FLY!

Jim Patillo

P.S.Flew to Truckee, CA (Reno)in the Sierras yesterday. Lots of snow in them thar hills.

--- In Q-LIST@..., "Clive" <gobxoy@> wrote:

Hi Jim
Missed your last reply(away for the Hols)
Appologies, should have said dangley tailwheels.
It,s the tailwheel in the slipstream that does the damage aerowise, that's why mine is tucked up behind the fin as much as possible.
Lets not confuse aero for convinence, thats a personal prefrence.
The original tail wheel geometry was just plain wrong exaberbated when pointing the tailwheel down to get the correct ground angle.
When the geometry is corrected they can be made to work just dandy, but without the kickout mode. Again PP.
I would agree that the average Q2-200 is not as clean as a Klaus' Varieze, but are closer than you give credit and can be made realy quite good. Check out the sq plate area in the old cafe 400's Sheehan at one point showed less than Hertzler.
Klaus's engine is anything from standard, aswell as a very clean airframe, but you got to admitt their bow main gear ahead of the prop arc hurts them alot.
If you want to go fast it's not just drag and weight that's critical how about horse power?
Klaus has the lot, and has spent alot of time/money to get there.
Sam handicaped himself in the last race IMHO, no offence Sam.
BTW what weight is your Q Jim I think I have you at approx 775 lbs empty?
Happy new year
Clive ... Gobxoy

--- In Q-LIST@..., "Jim P" <logistics_engineering@> wrote:

Hi Clive,

Me and many others have had that "aftermarket" tailwheel installed for a very long time and as far as I know everyone flying it, is happy. I haven't heard one complaint. For me, I'm willing to trade a couple of knots for convienence. "Turns on one main (with dual brakes), unlatching the full swivel allows the plane to be handled much more easily on the ground, also allows for canard incidence adjustment, more beefy and better control down the runway.

The video Sam provided shows "things" laid across the airstream and I can see that drag, but what happens when you turn that rod in line and flow air over it lengthwize? What kind of drag does that create? NOT MUCH. The vertical area of the tailwheel on the other hand does create drag but so does the original tailwheel.

There's no doubt drag is critical but if it's ones goal to have the lightest and cleanest Q in the air, one should start that concept from the first layup, not at the end of the project. Again, given the available engines and HP, I believe this plane hits the wall at around 215-220 MPH no matter what you do. Unlike Klaus' EZE , this airframe is not nearly as clean. If Sam or anyone else for that matter ever goes faster than that, I'm all ears.

Merry Christmas

Jim Patillo - Going out for another flight over Yosemite this AM. Its beautiful up there. We're really fortunate out here with all the great flying days.

--- In Q-LIST@..., "Clive" <gobxoy@> wrote:

Nice one Sam,

That certainly puts drag into perspective.

Looks those aftermarket tails wheels that hang down are a high drag item.

Merry Christmas all.

Clive Gobxoy

--- In Q-LIST@..., oneskydog@ wrote:

Especially propellers

In a message dated 12/21/2010 9:33:11 A.M. Mountain Standard Time,
dmperry1012@ writes:

Wow! Thank you, Sam. Great Video.

I noticed the sound level went up as the drag went up -- if it's making
noise it's making drag.

Mike Perry

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