----- Original Message -----
From: quickieflyer
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 11:30 AM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Re: Prop selection / Sterba props


Peter,
I didn't see what prop you were looking for? Is it a Rev or 0-200? I
might be able to help.
David Hiatt
Seattle


> After surfing the props and drooling over the ones I cannot afford ,
how about the Ed sterba wood prop for $500 ? Is there any feedback
favourable or otherwise?
> Thanks , Peter
>
>
>






Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org





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----- Original Message -----
From: "davedrosen" <d2r@txol.net>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 8:30 PM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Re: Q1 mods

Smooth,
My q1 is getting a 60 Hp, Hexadyne Engine, should see it in two
weeks. Putting on a custum made composite Price Aviation Prop, should
have it this week. Intrument panel is not attached to the canopy. Has
Garmin gps and transponder, with xcom760 radio, and a Taskem monitor
(can see pics on Q1 group). Using go kart brakes. Pitch trim will be
based upon a spring cylinder used in Cirrus aircraft. Beefed up rudder
to fuselage connection. Beefed up firewall to support bigger engine.
Hope to fly Next spring to sun n fun or if I don't make it oshcosh in
July. That covers most of my mods... oh, access hatch in back to
access push tubes, and dual cables so rudder and tail wheel are
seperate.

If your just starting a kit... to be done by spring is very
aggressive. I wish you luck. I think it should be a fun machine.

Dave R.
Q1
Texas


--- In Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com, "smoothmatson" <smoothmatson@y...>
wrote:

Hi i recently purchased a partially built q1 kit. I was wondering
what mods others have done on theirs...engines, wheels, brakes,
sliding rails, instruments...ect. It seems like everywhere i look
everyone says 503 rotax. Is there ne thing in between onan 22 and

503

rotax? Please ne info will be helpful. I hope to have my kit
completed by spring.

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

-----Original Message-----
From: britmcman@aol.com
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, 8 Oct 2005 22:02:20 EDT
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Wheel cam guys.


Phil and Cherie are doing great. Cherie is back to working 18 hours/day on
the horse ranch. My rotator cuff surgery is four weeks past now and I am
getting some word that therapy is going well and full range of motion is just
about achieved. Many more weeks of therapy to follow.

Cheers,

Phil & Cherie







Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
Peter Harris
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 7:48 AM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] RE: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with
carb?

Ron that sounds like a good design using exhaust pressure to pump cooling
air and a real throttle body as backup to fuel injection.I thought I had
invented the second item...... dang you will be the first to try it.Have you
got pics and details.
Also I am looking at ram air plenum supplied by Jabiru to direct air onto
the cyls. Is that your plenum ? Has anyone got performance details for this
mod? I was planning to do the conventional and carefully shroud the engine
heads to force feed air through the fins. Ram air ducts or a plenum would
increase pressure and airspeed through the fins but not necessarily improve
heat transfer and cooling?.
Peter
----- Original Message -----
From: Ron
To: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 10:12 AM
Subject: [Q-LIST] RE: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with
carb?


Lynn and David, Lynn, I hope you don't mind but I have made my plenums
similar to yours in a few ways around the spark plugs and the area they
cover. I am going ahead and adding the top and bottom deflectors inside
the
plenums which will end up out the bottom center with a 4 into 1 exhaust
helping to pull the air through. I also am using one mag with one
electronic
ignition, the Mega Squirt and Mega Jolt which I have built. The pickup for
it is already mounted behind my prop hub as shown in the picture. I sure
like the idea of having backup for the injection by leaving the carb which
I
will also work on. I have uploaded the latest photos of the above and can
be seen on page 10 link at the bottom of this message. Will add them to
the
Q engine page photo section also. Let me know if you see anything wrong. I
was very impressed with your plenums back at Spring Fling.



Ron Triano



Ron's Quickies, Page 8 is the Q200 and 9 is the Quickie and page 10 is a
new
Q200 page.
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page8.html

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page9.html

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page10.html



_____

From: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of French
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 3:56 PM
To: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with carb?



David,

Prior to this recent discussion on fuel injections I was planning to buy a
Klaus or Rose electronic ignition for one set of my plugs. I have now
completely changed my focus to a complete Engine Control system with
integrated fuel injection and ignition control. For only a couple hundred
dollars more I have fuel injection along with the electronic ignition I
wanted previously. I have narrowed my search down to 3 brands and have
been
putting together the components list. The fuel injection side of this
looks
to be much more straight forward than I would have thought since I am
currently planning on only making new intake runners and leaving the carb
intact as the backup up fuel source as we spoke. The ignition side will be
electronic on one side only for now coming from the ECU. The other side
will
remain as a mag for redundancy until a good alternative comes along. The
mag
will be controlled by the P lead as it is now with a second ignition
switch
controlling the electronic side. I have updated the design of my
electrical
system to accomadate the need for electrical redundancy. I am currently
thinking through the run-up checklist for proper confirmation that all
redundant systems are operational. Then it's time to get out the check
book.
Downfall is that I will be adding a net 4 pounds after removing one mag.
Guess I won't worry about what to do this winter - not that that has ever
been a problem. Anyway a long ramble on where I'm at on this, but I
welcome
anyone's feedback.



Regarding the mold for the plenums, I guess I had never thought about it.
I
am very pleased with these and would do it exactly the same way again,
except maybe not so many plies so as to make it lighter. They snap on and
fit like a glove and yet allows easy access to the plugs. The other thing
I
might change is maybe improve the transition from the plenums to the
cowling. Needs some sort of boot or something that will slid on and off
easily with the cowl. Maybe sometime when I have them off I can pop a mold
off of them. Did you come out OK with yours?



Lynn





Lynn,

I'm not an electrical guy, but the P-lead would handle the mag side, and I
hadn't thought about the wiring the two spark sources together. You're
much
sharper at this stuff than I.



Another topic:

Have you ever thought of making molds of your engine plenums? I know after
making mine, I would have gladly bought some from a mold.



D




_____




Cool! I'm liking this idea. What are the con's of doing this? Carb is
heavier than throttle body, carb is an expensive throttle body, adapting
of
TPS to carb. I can handle all of those in exchange for redundancy, what
others?



Lynn French



Lynn,

Actually, what I'm saying! But you don't need to shut off the fuel to
the
carb, just go full lean on the mixture lever. That way if you need to
restart you would have the carb bowl full and ready to go. It will work
and
has been done, I just don't have the energy to do it. ;-)

~D~


_____




David,

I think I understand what you are saying......use the carberator as the
throttle body for the fuel injected system and just add a Throttle
Position
Sensor to feed the ECU. Have a seperate fuel shutoff for the carb fuel and
if the Electronic system fails just turn on the fuel to the carb. Ignition
can be backup up in several ways including one of the mags. Is this what
you
are saying you have seen? Seems like it would work.

Thanks

LF



Isn't Clause doing that with his Vari EZ, I heard that somewhere and I
think
it is a good idea also. Probably will do something like that with my Mega
Squirt.



Ron T







I have seen a TPS on a carb using it at a redundant fuel supply or
(system).
And I don't see why one could drive both plugs with electronic ignition
with
the mag still in place and activating the mag incase of failure of the
ECU.



David Hiatt

Seattle

Home of more un-flying Quickies than any other place in the world.

;-)


_____


I struggled with all the same questions before selecting the SDS
EFI.

Looking at failure modes of the SDS type EFI system it will probably
be the entire controller unit that fails if ther is a failure.
(remember that it still has dual coil packs driving two sets of plugs
and I think that there would be an extreamly low probability that
both coil packs would fail at the same moment). That is why I felt
that a seperate source of spark on one set of plugs did'nt buy me
much saftey. Last time I checked you needed fire, fuel, air, and
compression to make power. Take any one of them away and you are in
just as much trouble as if they all went away. I also considered a
secondary spark source on one set of plugs, but with a mag you lose
the abaility to advance/retard spark timing. If you are after more
power, then the secondary spark source would have to be electronic.

So yes, an EFI system failure will probably make the engine stop.
And yes, if you lose one mag in a dual mag and carb setup all you
have is reduced performance, and if that makes you sleep better, then
make that choice.

Again, I am not trying to sell a particular setup either way, just
add some insight into my choice. I wanted the increased performance
and was willing to accept what I determined to be the very small
additional EFI "single point" failure risk by using good quality
brand new equipment with an installation that has hundreds of flight
hours on it. We can all tell stories of old cars that broke down.
That's not what I'm putting on my plane. I can also tell stories of
carb ice, bad fuel, worn mags, ...

Remember, there is no such thing as a fail safe airplane, and we will
all live or die with our own choices. For me it's a game of risk
management.

Hope this helps, Tom in Tucson





_____

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< http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Q-200_Engine_Group> " on the web.


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_____







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_____

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* Visit your group " Q-LIST <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Q-LIST>
" on the web.

* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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_____

----- Original Message -----
From: rondefly@rtriano.com
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 10:27 PM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] RE: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with carb?


Peter, No, I won't be the first to try it as I have been copying the formula
1 and biplanes from Reno. Out of all the plenums I have looked at I liked
parts of LF's the best and did use some of his features. I first learned
about the fuel injection + carb that was being used by Clause who races his
very fast VariEZ. I have to update this computer with the latest picts as it
doesn't have the page 10 link on my emails. My plenums are completely
separate from the cowls both upper and lower. Won't need any connector
pieces. Check out the Q list pictures under my name..

Ron Triano

Ron & Carolyn Triano Q-200 N4710P
My Web
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page8.html
Quickie 1:
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page9.html


-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
Peter Harris
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 7:48 AM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] RE: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with
carb?

Ron that sounds like a good design using exhaust pressure to pump cooling
air and a real throttle body as backup to fuel injection.I thought I had
invented the second item...... dang you will be the first to try it.Have you
got pics and details.
Also I am looking at ram air plenum supplied by Jabiru to direct air onto
the cyls. Is that your plenum ? Has anyone got performance details for this
mod? I was planning to do the conventional and carefully shroud the engine
heads to force feed air through the fins. Ram air ducts or a plenum would
increase pressure and airspeed through the fins but not necessarily improve
heat transfer and cooling?.
Peter
----- Original Message -----
From: Ron
To: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 10:12 AM
Subject: [Q-LIST] RE: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with
carb?


Lynn and David, Lynn, I hope you don't mind but I have made my plenums
similar to yours in a few ways around the spark plugs and the area they
cover. I am going ahead and adding the top and bottom deflectors inside
the
plenums which will end up out the bottom center with a 4 into 1 exhaust
helping to pull the air through. I also am using one mag with one
electronic
ignition, the Mega Squirt and Mega Jolt which I have built. The pickup for
it is already mounted behind my prop hub as shown in the picture. I sure
like the idea of having backup for the injection by leaving the carb which
I
will also work on. I have uploaded the latest photos of the above and can
be seen on page 10 link at the bottom of this message. Will add them to
the
Q engine page photo section also. Let me know if you see anything wrong. I
was very impressed with your plenums back at Spring Fling.



Ron Triano



Ron's Quickies, Page 8 is the Q200 and 9 is the Quickie and page 10 is a
new
Q200 page.
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page8.html

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page9.html

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page10.html



_____

From: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of French
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 3:56 PM
To: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with carb?



David,

Prior to this recent discussion on fuel injections I was planning to buy a
Klaus or Rose electronic ignition for one set of my plugs. I have now
completely changed my focus to a complete Engine Control system with
integrated fuel injection and ignition control. For only a couple hundred
dollars more I have fuel injection along with the electronic ignition I
wanted previously. I have narrowed my search down to 3 brands and have
been
putting together the components list. The fuel injection side of this
looks
to be much more straight forward than I would have thought since I am
currently planning on only making new intake runners and leaving the carb
intact as the backup up fuel source as we spoke. The ignition side will be
electronic on one side only for now coming from the ECU. The other side
will
remain as a mag for redundancy until a good alternative comes along. The
mag
will be controlled by the P lead as it is now with a second ignition
switch
controlling the electronic side. I have updated the design of my
electrical
system to accomadate the need for electrical redundancy. I am currently
thinking through the run-up checklist for proper confirmation that all
redundant systems are operational. Then it's time to get out the check
book.
Downfall is that I will be adding a net 4 pounds after removing one mag.
Guess I won't worry about what to do this winter - not that that has ever
been a problem. Anyway a long ramble on where I'm at on this, but I
welcome
anyone's feedback.



Regarding the mold for the plenums, I guess I had never thought about it.
I
am very pleased with these and would do it exactly the same way again,
except maybe not so many plies so as to make it lighter. They snap on and
fit like a glove and yet allows easy access to the plugs. The other thing
I
might change is maybe improve the transition from the plenums to the
cowling. Needs some sort of boot or something that will slid on and off
easily with the cowl. Maybe sometime when I have them off I can pop a mold
off of them. Did you come out OK with yours?



Lynn





Lynn,

I'm not an electrical guy, but the P-lead would handle the mag side, and I
hadn't thought about the wiring the two spark sources together. You're
much
sharper at this stuff than I.



Another topic:

Have you ever thought of making molds of your engine plenums? I know after
making mine, I would have gladly bought some from a mold.



D




_____




Cool! I'm liking this idea. What are the con's of doing this? Carb is
heavier than throttle body, carb is an expensive throttle body, adapting
of
TPS to carb. I can handle all of those in exchange for redundancy, what
others?



Lynn French



Lynn,

Actually, what I'm saying! But you don't need to shut off the fuel to
the
carb, just go full lean on the mixture lever. That way if you need to
restart you would have the carb bowl full and ready to go. It will work
and
has been done, I just don't have the energy to do it. ;-)

~D~


_____




David,

I think I understand what you are saying......use the carberator as the
throttle body for the fuel injected system and just add a Throttle
Position
Sensor to feed the ECU. Have a seperate fuel shutoff for the carb fuel and
if the Electronic system fails just turn on the fuel to the carb. Ignition
can be backup up in several ways including one of the mags. Is this what
you
are saying you have seen? Seems like it would work.

Thanks

LF



Isn't Clause doing that with his Vari EZ, I heard that somewhere and I
think
it is a good idea also. Probably will do something like that with my Mega
Squirt.



Ron T







I have seen a TPS on a carb using it at a redundant fuel supply or
(system).
And I don't see why one could drive both plugs with electronic ignition
with
the mag still in place and activating the mag incase of failure of the
ECU.



David Hiatt

Seattle

Home of more un-flying Quickies than any other place in the world.

;-)


_____


I struggled with all the same questions before selecting the SDS
EFI.

Looking at failure modes of the SDS type EFI system it will probably
be the entire controller unit that fails if ther is a failure.
(remember that it still has dual coil packs driving two sets of plugs
and I think that there would be an extreamly low probability that
both coil packs would fail at the same moment). That is why I felt
that a seperate source of spark on one set of plugs did'nt buy me
much saftey. Last time I checked you needed fire, fuel, air, and
compression to make power. Take any one of them away and you are in
just as much trouble as if they all went away. I also considered a
secondary spark source on one set of plugs, but with a mag you lose
the abaility to advance/retard spark timing. If you are after more
power, then the secondary spark source would have to be electronic.

So yes, an EFI system failure will probably make the engine stop.
And yes, if you lose one mag in a dual mag and carb setup all you
have is reduced performance, and if that makes you sleep better, then
make that choice.

Again, I am not trying to sell a particular setup either way, just
add some insight into my choice. I wanted the increased performance
and was willing to accept what I determined to be the very small
additional EFI "single point" failure risk by using good quality
brand new equipment with an installation that has hundreds of flight
hours on it. We can all tell stories of old cars that broke down.
That's not what I'm putting on my plane. I can also tell stories of
carb ice, bad fuel, worn mags, ...

Remember, there is no such thing as a fail safe airplane, and we will
all live or die with our own choices. For me it's a game of risk
management.

Hope this helps, Tom in Tucson





_____

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS



* Visit your group "Q-200_Engine_Group
< http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Q-200_Engine_Group> " on the web.


* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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< http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service.



_____







Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org





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SPONSORED LINKS Aviation maintenance Aviation maintenance training Aviation maintenance schools
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-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 10/9/2005 1:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

How about Helena, Montana. I was there recently and the facilities are
excellent.

James Postma
Q2 Revmaster N145EX
Q2 Revmaster with LS-1
Q200 N8427
Steilacoom, Washington
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT
May your header tank be always full and your wings right side up.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Letempt, Jeffrey MR" <jeffrey.letempt@us.army.mil>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 12:29 PM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

Thought that was the purpose of the Mountain States and Livermore

Fly-In?

The Field of Dreams Fly-In will remain in the middle of the US, maybe

MO,

OK, NE, IA, or OK. There truly is a lot of thought that goes into

selecting

a location for a fly-in like this.

For the last 3 years (the years I coordinated the fly-in at Sullivan)

the

majority of the people have driven to the event. Next are the guys

who
fly

their TW planes in and there area few guys who will fly-in

commercially to
a

major airport.

Of course most of us have very busy schedules and it can be hard to

get
away

for 4-5 days to fully take advantage of our fly-in. For this reason I

think

it is worthwhile to move the event around once in a while. Someone

could

not justify driving 700 miles to a fly-in, but maybe 400 is doable.

I understand that it is difficult and costly to fly a TW plane from CA

to
MO

for a weekend fly-in. Typically the overwhelming majority of TW

airplanes

come from an adjoining state. Of course there are exceptions, Charlie
Johnson, Jim Patillo, and Dave Dugas come to mind. It would probably

make

little or no difference for me or Sam, or Lynn, or Bruce, or Paul if

the

fly-in was moved a few hundred miles in any direction. If it moved

west a

little I do not think it would seriously impact the guys from flying

their

plane to the event. A few hundred miles east would make it further

from
the

west coast guys, and I do not think that would help increase

participation.

Close proximity to a large commercial airport is important for the

guys
who

will fly in commercially. It is also important to have lodging and

things

like that close by the event airport. It should not be inside Class B
airspace and it should have a large enough ramp area and hangar space

for

all the airplanes. Sullivan pretty much fits the bill for everything.

A

fantastic rural airport that does not charge us anything with 5 hotels
within about 1 mile and maybe a little over a one hour drive from St

Louis

Lambert International Airport.

Spud has volunteered to organize the event at Ottawa, KS next year.

If

things do not work out with that, I am looking at an airport in SE

Nebraska.

On paper the airport looks good, but I have never been there to take a

look.

It is not far from Doug or Lynn...either of you guys been to Beatrice,

NE

(KBIE)?

Jeff


-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf

Of

rondefly@rtriano.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 10:09 AM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

Try about 1500 miles for the west coast guys.

Ron T

Ron & Carolyn Triano Q-200 N4710P
My Web

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page8.htm
l

Quickie 1:

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page9.htm
l

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf

Of

Letempt, Jeffrey MR
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 6:48 AM
To: 'Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

Paul,

I understand.....I just had someone contact me from the east coast

saying

the event needs to be pushed back a couple weeks due to weather. No

firm

plans yet, but the fly-in will likely move west a couple hundred miles

next

year.

Suggestions are greatly appreciated!!!

Jeff



Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


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----- Original Message -----
From: Ron
To: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
Cc: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2005 10:12 AM
Subject: [Q-LIST] RE: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with carb?


Lynn and David, Lynn, I hope you don't mind but I have made my plenums
similar to yours in a few ways around the spark plugs and the area they
cover. I am going ahead and adding the top and bottom deflectors inside the
plenums which will end up out the bottom center with a 4 into 1 exhaust
helping to pull the air through. I also am using one mag with one electronic
ignition, the Mega Squirt and Mega Jolt which I have built. The pickup for
it is already mounted behind my prop hub as shown in the picture. I sure
like the idea of having backup for the injection by leaving the carb which I
will also work on. I have uploaded the latest photos of the above and can
be seen on page 10 link at the bottom of this message. Will add them to the
Q engine page photo section also. Let me know if you see anything wrong. I
was very impressed with your plenums back at Spring Fling.



Ron Triano



Ron's Quickies, Page 8 is the Q200 and 9 is the Quickie and page 10 is a new
Q200 page.
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page8.html

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page9.html

http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page10.html



_____

From: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of French
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 3:56 PM
To: Q-200_Engine_Group@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Q-200_Engine_Group] Fuel injection anyone with carb?



David,

Prior to this recent discussion on fuel injections I was planning to buy a
Klaus or Rose electronic ignition for one set of my plugs. I have now
completely changed my focus to a complete Engine Control system with
integrated fuel injection and ignition control. For only a couple hundred
dollars more I have fuel injection along with the electronic ignition I
wanted previously. I have narrowed my search down to 3 brands and have been
putting together the components list. The fuel injection side of this looks
to be much more straight forward than I would have thought since I am
currently planning on only making new intake runners and leaving the carb
intact as the backup up fuel source as we spoke. The ignition side will be
electronic on one side only for now coming from the ECU. The other side will
remain as a mag for redundancy until a good alternative comes along. The mag
will be controlled by the P lead as it is now with a second ignition switch
controlling the electronic side. I have updated the design of my electrical
system to accomadate the need for electrical redundancy. I am currently
thinking through the run-up checklist for proper confirmation that all
redundant systems are operational. Then it's time to get out the check book.
Downfall is that I will be adding a net 4 pounds after removing one mag.
Guess I won't worry about what to do this winter - not that that has ever
been a problem. Anyway a long ramble on where I'm at on this, but I welcome
anyone's feedback.



Regarding the mold for the plenums, I guess I had never thought about it. I
am very pleased with these and would do it exactly the same way again,
except maybe not so many plies so as to make it lighter. They snap on and
fit like a glove and yet allows easy access to the plugs. The other thing I
might change is maybe improve the transition from the plenums to the
cowling. Needs some sort of boot or something that will slid on and off
easily with the cowl. Maybe sometime when I have them off I can pop a mold
off of them. Did you come out OK with yours?



Lynn





Lynn,

I'm not an electrical guy, but the P-lead would handle the mag side, and I
hadn't thought about the wiring the two spark sources together. You're much
sharper at this stuff than I.



Another topic:

Have you ever thought of making molds of your engine plenums? I know after
making mine, I would have gladly bought some from a mold.



D




_____




Cool! I'm liking this idea. What are the con's of doing this? Carb is
heavier than throttle body, carb is an expensive throttle body, adapting of
TPS to carb. I can handle all of those in exchange for redundancy, what
others?



Lynn French



Lynn,

Actually, what I'm saying! But you don't need to shut off the fuel to the
carb, just go full lean on the mixture lever. That way if you need to
restart you would have the carb bowl full and ready to go. It will work and
has been done, I just don't have the energy to do it. ;-)

~D~


_____




David,

I think I understand what you are saying......use the carberator as the
throttle body for the fuel injected system and just add a Throttle Position
Sensor to feed the ECU. Have a seperate fuel shutoff for the carb fuel and
if the Electronic system fails just turn on the fuel to the carb. Ignition
can be backup up in several ways including one of the mags. Is this what you
are saying you have seen? Seems like it would work.

Thanks

LF



Isn't Clause doing that with his Vari EZ, I heard that somewhere and I think
it is a good idea also. Probably will do something like that with my Mega
Squirt.



Ron T







I have seen a TPS on a carb using it at a redundant fuel supply or (system).
And I don't see why one could drive both plugs with electronic ignition with
the mag still in place and activating the mag incase of failure of the ECU.



David Hiatt

Seattle

Home of more un-flying Quickies than any other place in the world.

;-)


_____


I struggled with all the same questions before selecting the SDS
EFI.

Looking at failure modes of the SDS type EFI system it will probably
be the entire controller unit that fails if ther is a failure.
(remember that it still has dual coil packs driving two sets of plugs
and I think that there would be an extreamly low probability that
both coil packs would fail at the same moment). That is why I felt
that a seperate source of spark on one set of plugs did'nt buy me
much saftey. Last time I checked you needed fire, fuel, air, and
compression to make power. Take any one of them away and you are in
just as much trouble as if they all went away. I also considered a
secondary spark source on one set of plugs, but with a mag you lose
the abaility to advance/retard spark timing. If you are after more
power, then the secondary spark source would have to be electronic.

So yes, an EFI system failure will probably make the engine stop.
And yes, if you lose one mag in a dual mag and carb setup all you
have is reduced performance, and if that makes you sleep better, then
make that choice.

Again, I am not trying to sell a particular setup either way, just
add some insight into my choice. I wanted the increased performance
and was willing to accept what I determined to be the very small
additional EFI "single point" failure risk by using good quality
brand new equipment with an installation that has hundreds of flight
hours on it. We can all tell stories of old cars that broke down.
That's not what I'm putting on my plane. I can also tell stories of
carb ice, bad fuel, worn mags, ...

Remember, there is no such thing as a fail safe airplane, and we will
all live or die with our own choices. For me it's a game of risk
management.

Hope this helps, Tom in Tucson





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----- Original Message -----
From: "Letempt, Jeffrey MR" <jeffrey.letempt@us.army.mil>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 12:29 PM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

Thought that was the purpose of the Mountain States and Livermore Fly-In?
The Field of Dreams Fly-In will remain in the middle of the US, maybe MO,
OK, NE, IA, or OK. There truly is a lot of thought that goes into

selecting

a location for a fly-in like this.

For the last 3 years (the years I coordinated the fly-in at Sullivan) the
majority of the people have driven to the event. Next are the guys who

fly

their TW planes in and there area few guys who will fly-in commercially to

a

major airport.

Of course most of us have very busy schedules and it can be hard to get

away

for 4-5 days to fully take advantage of our fly-in. For this reason I

think

it is worthwhile to move the event around once in a while. Someone could
not justify driving 700 miles to a fly-in, but maybe 400 is doable.

I understand that it is difficult and costly to fly a TW plane from CA to

MO

for a weekend fly-in. Typically the overwhelming majority of TW airplanes
come from an adjoining state. Of course there are exceptions, Charlie
Johnson, Jim Patillo, and Dave Dugas come to mind. It would probably make
little or no difference for me or Sam, or Lynn, or Bruce, or Paul if the
fly-in was moved a few hundred miles in any direction. If it moved west a
little I do not think it would seriously impact the guys from flying their
plane to the event. A few hundred miles east would make it further from

the

west coast guys, and I do not think that would help increase

participation.

Close proximity to a large commercial airport is important for the guys

who

will fly in commercially. It is also important to have lodging and things
like that close by the event airport. It should not be inside Class B
airspace and it should have a large enough ramp area and hangar space for
all the airplanes. Sullivan pretty much fits the bill for everything. A
fantastic rural airport that does not charge us anything with 5 hotels
within about 1 mile and maybe a little over a one hour drive from St Louis
Lambert International Airport.

Spud has volunteered to organize the event at Ottawa, KS next year. If
things do not work out with that, I am looking at an airport in SE

Nebraska.

On paper the airport looks good, but I have never been there to take a

look.

It is not far from Doug or Lynn...either of you guys been to Beatrice, NE
(KBIE)?

Jeff


-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
rondefly@rtriano.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 10:09 AM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

Try about 1500 miles for the west coast guys.

Ron T

Ron & Carolyn Triano Q-200 N4710P
My Web
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page8.html
Quickie 1:
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page9.html


-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
Letempt, Jeffrey MR
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 6:48 AM
To: 'Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Annual Field of Dreams Fly-In

Paul,

I understand.....I just had someone contact me from the east coast saying
the event needs to be pushed back a couple weeks due to weather. No firm
plans yet, but the fly-in will likely move west a couple hundred miles

next

year.

Suggestions are greatly appreciated!!!

Jeff



Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kerri & Mark" <ksm@slingshot.co.nz>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2005 11:21 PM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Rotary Info

www.wankel-rotary.com

Leon this is what I was looking at I have sent e-mail to Sales department
and am awaiting a responce

Will let you all know if this is a goose chase

Mark ZK-JGZ

=========================================
This is the one (LCR 407 SG/K (KR) or SG/W) I've kind of decided is the most
viable option. They don't build the motors themselves and somewhere on one
of my inactive hard drives I have the contact info they gave me for their
source. I'd already have one hung on the front of my Quickie but they are
kind of pricey due to the current exchange rate between the Euro and the
US$.

There is another individual on this group that is trying to kind of reverse
engineer this motor for production in North America............At least I
think it's the same powerplant. If they manage to get it done, and for the
price range that was quotes for a target I'll be making humming noises :-)
==================
Leon McAtee

----- Original Message -----
From: "smoothmatson" <smoothmatson@yahoo.ca>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 07, 2005 5:50 PM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Q1 mods

Hi i recently purchased a partially built q1 kit. I was wondering
what mods others have done on theirs...engines, wheels, brakes,
sliding rails, instruments...ect. It seems like everywhere i look
everyone says 503 rotax. Is there ne thing in between onan 22 and 503
rotax? Please ne info will be helpful. I hope to have my kit
completed by spring.






Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

----- Original Message -----
From: <britmcman@aol.com>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, October 07, 2005 10:17 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Wheel cam guys.

Approved supplier for Q-200 slide rails is Home Depot. Look across the street from Lowe's.
Phil (Lucky Lankford with a 'K")
Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org
Yahoo! Groups Links

----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Harris" <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 1:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Engine options for my Q1

Mark I have some experience with rotary engines . What are the details.

Peter

----- Original Message -----
From: Kerri & Mark
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2005 12:54 PM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Engine options for my Q1


Hi Team

Have been reading newsletters like mad since receiving them the other

week

and very interesting reading...
I now have two sets of build instructions and a box of templets and some
triangle jigs. all sorts of bits and pieces
Three questions
1 I have a second Q1 canopy that has minor marks on it , was told that

it

came in contact with fence wire can it be repaired...
2 single rotar rotary engine any oen that has been there can I talk to a

bit

more, I like the low weight and high Hp
3 I pulling ZK-JGZ apart for a good look at all moving parts, I have

some

parts for a reflexor system and think while it is in bits this would be

the

time to be it as when she is assembled I don't see me being that keen to
ground her again.

Mark Fitzgerald
Very pleased with Q1 ZK-JGZ (old reg)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Harris" <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Engine mount question


> Thanks Leon. I notice something else about the elevator pushrod

geometry,

although unrelated. The elevators move about 1/8 to1/4" like aelerons

and in

the same direction. Maybe this adds to the "aeleron steering" effect.
> Peter
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Leon - C
> To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 11:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Engine mount question
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter Harris" <peterjfharris@bigpond.com>
> : Re: [Q-LIST] Engine mount question
>
>
> > After sifting through all the responses I suppose the best fix is

also

the
> easiest. Torque and the P factor are turning the aircraft away from

prop

> rotation. By trimming the elevator or the ailerons we can offset

this

and
> the elevator requires only a very small adjustment. By trimming the
correct
> side up we should get a small reduction in drag as well.
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> I ran across an interesting thing that may be related to this while
reverse
> engineering the Quickie for my CAD drawings. CSA-6 and CSA-7 (the
elevator
> control arms on the Quickie) do not have the same ratio. I checked

2

sets
> of parts and they were both identical, and since the parts were all
punched
> out by Ken Brock, I'm assuming that all the Quickie kits had the

same

> different ratio (1/16" or about 5%) elevator links. I don't have

any

idea
> if this was
> intended but the result would be that one elevator would deflect

just a

bit
> more than the other - tending to off set "P" factor.
>
> One might be able to do the same thing with the Q-2/200...... but

IIRC

they
> have identical parts right and left due to the center stick.
> ======================
> Leon McAtee
>
>
>
>
>
> Quickie Builders Association WEB site
> http://www.quickiebuilders.org
>
>
>
>
>

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> a.. Visit your group "Q-LIST" on the web.
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> Q-LIST-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
>
>

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----
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Quickie Builders Association WEB site
> http://www.quickiebuilders.org
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>



Quickie Builders Association WEB site
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