Date   

Re: Larger fuel tank under seat + higher cabin headroom.

David J. Gall
 

What was the project?


David J. Gall

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...]
On Behalf Of Christopher
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 5:44 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] Re: Larger fuel tank under seat + higher
cabin headroom.

That's the same thing an engineer told me on another project
which suceeded.

Christopher

Tht--- In Q-LIST@..., oneskydog@... wrote:


In a message dated 9/13/2006 8:12:52 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
qdf_files@... writes:

I'm pretty dedicated
towards doing something different from a regular Q or DF with my
project even if it takes me ten years to finish it. I want to put
a
T-Tail on it as the sole elevator and perhaps look into
flapperons
for both wings.



.
DOA RIP

Regards,

One Sky Dog


Re: First Post from RITZ ......Yikes...How do you fill the tires with air??

Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

Ritz you can buy a valve extension which screws onto the stem and extends to
the rim where you refit the valve itself. Tip :remember to rebalance the
wheels.

Peter



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Dave Dugas
Sent: Thursday, 14 September 2006 12:12 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] First Post from RITZ ......Yikes...How do you fill the
tires with air??



Hi RITZ

I hate to tell you this but if you can't see the valves you've got to remove
the wheel. Mine's the same way Dave D

q2blueskies <q2blueskies@ <mailto:q2blueskies%40yahoo.com> yahoo.com> wrote:
Hello evryone in the Q Group....
My Q2 is finally home, in the work shop and ready to work on...
I am embarrassed to ask?..
Ok...Am I missing somen? (smile)....
How do you fill the tires with air...
Twice we have moved my Q2 to get where it is... and twice, no one with
me, has been able get to the valve, even see the valve stem, for the
simple task of filing the tires up?.. So I turn to you for help?..
Thanking you in advance..
RITZ


---------------------------------
Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.


Re: First Post from RITZ ......Yikes...How do you fill the tires with air??

Dave Dugas
 

Hi RITZ

I hate to tell you this but if you can't see the valves you've got to remove the wheel. Mine's the same way Dave D

q2blueskies <q2blueskies@...> wrote:
Hello evryone in the Q Group....
My Q2 is finally home, in the work shop and ready to work on...
I am embarrassed to ask?..
Ok...Am I missing somen? (smile)....
How do you fill the tires with air...
Twice we have moved my Q2 to get where it is... and twice, no one with
me, has been able get to the valve, even see the valve stem, for the
simple task of filing the tires up?.. So I turn to you for help?..
Thanking you in advance..
RITZ






---------------------------------
Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.


Re: Larger fuel tank under seat + higher cabin headroom.

Tri-Q1 <rryan@...>
 

If you have a T-tail with an elevator it will just be another Bi-wing
airplane.

Ryan

--- In Q-LIST@..., "Christopher" <qdf_files@...> wrote:
I'm pretty dedicated
towards doing something different from a regular Q or DF with my
project even if it takes me ten years to finish it. I want to put a
T-Tail on it as the sole elevator and perhaps look into flapperons
for both wings.


First Post from RITZ ......Yikes...How do you fill the tires with air??

q2blueskies <q2blueskies@...>
 

Hello evryone in the Q Group....
My Q2 is finally home, in the work shop and ready to work on...
I am embarrassed to ask?..
Ok...Am I missing somen? (smile)....
How do you fill the tires with air...
Twice we have moved my Q2 to get where it is... and twice, no one with
me, has been able get to the valve, even see the valve stem, for the
simple task of filing the tires up?.. So I turn to you for help?..
Thanking you in advance..
RITZ


Re: Larger fuel tank under seat + higher cabin headroom.

Christopher <qdf_files@...>
 

That's the same thing an engineer told me on another project which
suceeded.

Christopher

Tht--- In Q-LIST@..., oneskydog@... wrote:


In a message dated 9/13/2006 8:12:52 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
qdf_files@... writes:

I'm pretty dedicated
towards doing something different from a regular Q or DF with my
project even if it takes me ten years to finish it. I want to put
a
T-Tail on it as the sole elevator and perhaps look into
flapperons
for both wings.



.
DOA RIP

Regards,

One Sky Dog




Re: Q2 --> Q200 ANSWER to RUSS MEYERRIECK'S question

David J. Gall
 

Russ,

You already found in paragraph 4 of the LS(1) addendum where they say the canard cores from B.L. 0 to B.L. 15 are cut into two pieces instead of one. Read the sentence immediately BEFORE that sentence. You will see that it says: "From B.L. 15 to B.L. 100, the hotwire block sizes are exactly the same as called out in the Q2 construction plans."

Yes, we all skip blindly past the words on the page on occasion! :)

Hope this is what you were looking for,


David J. Gall
PS If you have a set of the original, uncut LS1 hotwire templates (not copies), I'd sure like a chance to digitize them then return them to you....

----- Original Message -----
From: Russ <datachomper@...>
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] Re: Q2 --> Q200 ATTENTION RUSS MEYERRIECKS and DANNY CREECH
Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2006 14:39:35 -0000


Guys,
Please allow me to appologize. I must not be communicating my
question very well and I'm sorry.

I understand that the Q-200 uses the LS1 airfoil and a carbon spar
for the canard to fix the bug/rain problem with the GU airfoil and to
add extra support for the heavier 0-200 engine. So, here I am with the
LS1 templates in hand and ready to cut my foam cores. I pour through
all the documents that I've collected on the Q2/200 trying to find any
specific instructions for cutting out the "LS1" cores and I find none.
I've looked through the Q2 Manual, the LS1 Addendum, and Q200 Plans
section II (and I did a fruitless search in this yahoo group). The
closest thing I could find was in the beginning of the "LS1" Addendum
where they say the canard cores from BL0 to BL15 are cut into two
pieces instead of one. So I'm *assuming* I should cut the LS1
BL15-BL100 cores the same way as the GU cores would be cut. (I'm NOT
cutting GU airfoils).

Again, I appologize. Assumptions make me uneasy, especially
considering the magnitude of the project. All I wanted to do was
double check that I wasn't missing anything before I cut into my
expensive foam. I didn't mean for it to turn into a big ordeal.

Russ Meyerriecks
Huntsville, AL


Re: Fuel Tanks

Darrell Daniels <log@...>
 

Ron,
You could just ask me, I took a really quick look at the archives after your 1st post and gathered manometer test was a pressure test. Perhaps I am wrong in that assumption if so please tell me or I can order a back issue of quickie builders #109.
I have always called a pressure test a pressure test.I do want to thank everyone who replied and as I stated I learned a lot from this string.
I joined this list because I do not know everything and need help. Thanks again Darrell Daniels Tri Q Rebuild

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ron Triano" <rondefly@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 12:14 PM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I guess Darrell doesn't know what a manometer is.



Ron



Sonerai taxi testing


<http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page11.html>
http://bld01.ipowerweb.com/contentmanagement/websites/rtrianoc/page11.html

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 10:02 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks



Thanks Bob,
The leak test is what I was thinking I needed to do. What got me
started on this again was I asked why I could not run auto fuel in a VW
engine and one of the answers was that someone heard that auto fuel would
penetrate the epoxy. I am actual glad for this as I have learned a lot from
this thread . My thanks Darrell Daniels Tri Q rebuild
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Farnam" <bfarnam@pacbell. <mailto:bfarnam%40pacbell.net> net>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 11:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

If nothing extra was done by the original builder, there is some chance
that
it will leak. If you can't find out what was done during construction,
then
I guess my next step would be to do a long term leakdown test. This can be
done by sealing up all of the openings except the supply line to the pump.
Then put an inflated balloon on the supply line and let it sit for 24
hours
to see if any volume is lost. Check all the seal points with soapy water.
If
it is tight, go fly. If not, cut some holes and at least paint on more
epoxy
inside. Unfortunately, the internal baffles mean that you will have to cut
holes into each section between the baffles. Hope that it passes the
leakdown test. Understand that a tiny amount of leakage into the fuse foam
won't hurt the foam, which is fuelproof. Only the Styrafoam in the wings
is
at risk of dissolving. I recommend against any sealant except epoxy. I
have
heard (but don't know firsthand) that some of the elastomer sealants are
attacked by auto fuel. Others on this list may know about that.
Incidentally, EZ-Poxy is supposed to be the modern equivalent of
Safe-T-Poxy. My 7.5 gallon aux. tank is made of EZ-Poxy and is fine after
about 7 years.

Good luck!

Bob F.
N200QK
-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com]On Behalf
Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 6:00 AM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I did not build my airplane so what would be your recommendation Would
you
just put the auto fuel in and fly or cut some holes in the top of the
tank
and seal it with something. Thanks Darrell
----- Original Message -----
From: <bfarnam@pacbell. <mailto:bfarnam%40pacbell.net> net>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 1:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

Here's one more data point for you Darrell. My Q200 has been flying for
more than 8 years using auto gas when I am at home and 100LL away on a
trip. My tanks are made of Safe-T-Poxy. I have also had a sample of the
tank material soaking in auto gas with MTBE for about 7 years. There is
no
sign of softening or other problem. The main source of leakage that I
have
seen is into the fuselage layup which typically had a lot of pinholes.
Those can be sealed several ways during construction. Either sand and
recoat with a fairly heavy layer of epoxy, or some have added another
layer of glass. Mine is sealed with just an extra coating of epoxy.
Done
properly, the epoxy tanks won't leak.

Bob F.
N200QK


----- Original Message ----
From: Darrell Daniels <log@... <mailto:log%40nemr.net> >
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:19:03 PM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with the
idea
that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane .
I
also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which
is
not
really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want
to
burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any
other
ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q
rebuild







Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickieb <http://www.quickiebuilders.org> uilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

















Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickieb <http://www.quickiebuilders.org> uilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links

















Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links










Re: Q2 --> Q200 ATTENTION RUSS MEYERRIECKS and DANNY CREECH

Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

Russ,

The LS1 plans addendum leaves something to be desired and is lacking in some
detail. You need to read both sets of plans for the method to make the
canard. If you have figured out how to cut the cores using the LS1
templates, the section BL00-BL15 is just a matter of cutting the billets to
fit together in the cente. It makes more sense when all of the cores are set
up on the spars which are joined and held in the bench jigs. (Do it dry
first !). When ready to micro the cores onto the spars I found it is
important to get the slurry right, not too stiff. Otherwise the cores will
not bed deep into the spar and spar diameter is close to core thickness for
part of the length. You don't want to find the spar exposed when it is time
to sand down the airfoil.

Peter H



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Russ
Sent: Thursday, 14 September 2006 12:40 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] Re: Q2 --> Q200 ATTENTION RUSS MEYERRIECKS and DANNY
CREECH



Guys,
Please allow me to appologize. I must not be communicating my
question very well and I'm sorry.

I understand that the Q-200 uses the LS1 airfoil and a carbon spar
for the canard to fix the bug/rain problem with the GU airfoil and to
add extra support for the heavier 0-200 engine. So, here I am with the
LS1 templates in hand and ready to cut my foam cores. I pour through
all the documents that I've collected on the Q2/200 trying to find any
specific instructions for cutting out the "LS1" cores and I find none.
I've looked through the Q2 Manual, the LS1 Addendum, and Q200 Plans
section II (and I did a fruitless search in this yahoo group). The
closest thing I could find was in the beginning of the "LS1" Addendum
where they say the canard cores from BL0 to BL15 are cut into two
pieces instead of one. So I'm *assuming* I should cut the LS1
BL15-BL100 cores the same way as the GU cores would be cut. (I'm NOT
cutting GU airfoils).

Again, I appologize. Assumptions make me uneasy, especially
considering the magnitude of the project. All I wanted to do was
double check that I wasn't missing anything before I cut into my
expensive foam. I didn't mean for it to turn into a big ordeal.

Russ Meyerriecks
Huntsville, AL

--- In Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com, "David J.
Gall" <David@...> wrote:

"...[D]ifferent (stronger) front wing..."? No, not just stronger,
completely
different front wing. Different structure, different airfoil ( <---
RUSS!
You can't just use the Q2 airfoil templates!! ), different
thickness, etc.,
etc. Completely different. Also, different firewall, different
header tank,
different fuel system plumbing, and different aileron control system
(mass
balanced). Different CG range. Etc., etc.

There is not just one article or web page, there are entire websites
devoted
to these planes. Please READ the information on the Q-LIST yahoo groups
website and the QuickieBuilders.org website to get yourselves up to
speed on
these topics....


David J. Gall


Re: Larger fuel tank under seat + higher cabin headroom.

One Sky Dog
 

In a message dated 9/13/2006 8:12:52 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
qdf_files@... writes:

I'm pretty dedicated
towards doing something different from a regular Q or DF with my
project even if it takes me ten years to finish it. I want to put a
T-Tail on it as the sole elevator and perhaps look into flapperons
for both wings.



.
DOA RIP

Regards,

One Sky Dog


Re: Fuel Tanks

One Sky Dog
 

In a message dated 9/13/2006 7:37:22 AM Mountain Daylight Time, log@...
writes:




I did not build my airplane so what would be your recommendation Would you
just put the auto fuel in and fly or cut some holes in the top of the tank
and seal it with something. Thanks Darrell






Is it leaking? Have you ever filled it up?

??????????????

One Sky Dog


Re: Fuel Tanks

Terry Crouch
 

You are correct Dave.The light glass cloth was used because they thought a
heavy coat of straight epoxy might crack. My 12 year old Q1 tank is fine. Some
of the EZ's around here have 20+ years and 3000 + hours with car gas also
and no problems.

Terry Crouch

I recall hearing that Rutan and the EZ guys went to the very light
fiberglass cloth like they use on RC models to give the extra epoxy
coats on the inside of the tank some structure and to reduce the number
of pin holes. Perhaps Terry Crouch can comment on this or some of the
other guys familiar with the EZ's.



Dave Richardson


Re: Fuel Tanks

jeffs912ex@...
 

Not to confuse, but just FYI. The wing tanks in Pulsars are done that way.
They used two layers of 1.7 oz. fiberglass cloth. They then get two coats of
the thick black 2 part mix tank sealant. Sounds like overkill, but no problems
with mine after over seven years. I use auto and av gas.

Jeff Sell


Instructor with Q-Time

Phil Marshall <phil@...>
 

I need to get at least 5 hours with an instructor who has some Q
time. Does anyone know of one roughly between the upcoming fly-in
and New England?

---------------------
Phil Marshall
Signal Advertising
535 Stone Cutters Way
Montpelier, VT 05602
802-229-4149
phil@...


Re: Fuel Tanks

Ron Triano <rondefly@...>
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 10:02 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks



Thanks Bob,
The leak test is what I was thinking I needed to do. What got me
started on this again was I asked why I could not run auto fuel in a VW
engine and one of the answers was that someone heard that auto fuel would
penetrate the epoxy. I am actual glad for this as I have learned a lot from
this thread . My thanks Darrell Daniels Tri Q rebuild
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Farnam" <bfarnam@pacbell. <mailto:bfarnam%40pacbell.net> net>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 11:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

If nothing extra was done by the original builder, there is some chance
that
it will leak. If you can't find out what was done during construction,
then
I guess my next step would be to do a long term leakdown test. This can be
done by sealing up all of the openings except the supply line to the pump.
Then put an inflated balloon on the supply line and let it sit for 24
hours
to see if any volume is lost. Check all the seal points with soapy water.
If
it is tight, go fly. If not, cut some holes and at least paint on more
epoxy
inside. Unfortunately, the internal baffles mean that you will have to cut
holes into each section between the baffles. Hope that it passes the
leakdown test. Understand that a tiny amount of leakage into the fuse foam
won't hurt the foam, which is fuelproof. Only the Styrafoam in the wings
is
at risk of dissolving. I recommend against any sealant except epoxy. I
have
heard (but don't know firsthand) that some of the elastomer sealants are
attacked by auto fuel. Others on this list may know about that.
Incidentally, EZ-Poxy is supposed to be the modern equivalent of
Safe-T-Poxy. My 7.5 gallon aux. tank is made of EZ-Poxy and is fine after
about 7 years.

Good luck!

Bob F.
N200QK
-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com]On Behalf
Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 6:00 AM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I did not build my airplane so what would be your recommendation Would
you
just put the auto fuel in and fly or cut some holes in the top of the
tank
and seal it with something. Thanks Darrell
----- Original Message -----
From: <bfarnam@pacbell. <mailto:bfarnam%40pacbell.net> net>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 1:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

Here's one more data point for you Darrell. My Q200 has been flying for
more than 8 years using auto gas when I am at home and 100LL away on a
trip. My tanks are made of Safe-T-Poxy. I have also had a sample of the
tank material soaking in auto gas with MTBE for about 7 years. There is
no
sign of softening or other problem. The main source of leakage that I
have
seen is into the fuselage layup which typically had a lot of pinholes.
Those can be sealed several ways during construction. Either sand and
recoat with a fairly heavy layer of epoxy, or some have added another
layer of glass. Mine is sealed with just an extra coating of epoxy.
Done
properly, the epoxy tanks won't leak.

Bob F.
N200QK


----- Original Message ----
From: Darrell Daniels <log@... <mailto:log%40nemr.net> >
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:19:03 PM
Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with the
idea
that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane .
I
also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which
is
not
really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want
to
burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any
other
ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q
rebuild








Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickieb <http://www.quickiebuilders.org> uilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links


















Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickieb <http://www.quickiebuilders.org> uilders.org


Yahoo! Groups Links











Re: Fuel Tanks

Darrell Daniels <log@...>
 

Thanks Bob,
The leak test is what I was thinking I needed to do. What got me started on this again was I asked why I could not run auto fuel in a VW engine and one of the answers was that someone heard that auto fuel would penetrate the epoxy. I am actual glad for this as I have learned a lot from this thread . My thanks Darrell Daniels Tri Q rebuild

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Farnam" <bfarnam@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 11:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


If nothing extra was done by the original builder, there is some chance that
it will leak. If you can't find out what was done during construction, then
I guess my next step would be to do a long term leakdown test. This can be
done by sealing up all of the openings except the supply line to the pump.
Then put an inflated balloon on the supply line and let it sit for 24 hours
to see if any volume is lost. Check all the seal points with soapy water. If
it is tight, go fly. If not, cut some holes and at least paint on more epoxy
inside. Unfortunately, the internal baffles mean that you will have to cut
holes into each section between the baffles. Hope that it passes the
leakdown test. Understand that a tiny amount of leakage into the fuse foam
won't hurt the foam, which is fuelproof. Only the Styrafoam in the wings is
at risk of dissolving. I recommend against any sealant except epoxy. I have
heard (but don't know firsthand) that some of the elastomer sealants are
attacked by auto fuel. Others on this list may know about that.
Incidentally, EZ-Poxy is supposed to be the modern equivalent of
Safe-T-Poxy. My 7.5 gallon aux. tank is made of EZ-Poxy and is fine after
about 7 years.

Good luck!

Bob F.
N200QK
-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...]On Behalf Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 6:00 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I did not build my airplane so what would be your recommendation Would you
just put the auto fuel in and fly or cut some holes in the top of the tank
and seal it with something. Thanks Darrell
----- Original Message -----
From: <bfarnam@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 1:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

> Here's one more data point for you Darrell. My Q200 has been flying for
> more than 8 years using auto gas when I am at home and 100LL away on a
> trip. My tanks are made of Safe-T-Poxy. I have also had a sample of the
> tank material soaking in auto gas with MTBE for about 7 years. There is
no
> sign of softening or other problem. The main source of leakage that I
have
> seen is into the fuselage layup which typically had a lot of pinholes.
> Those can be sealed several ways during construction. Either sand and
> recoat with a fairly heavy layer of epoxy, or some have added another
> layer of glass. Mine is sealed with just an extra coating of epoxy.
Done
> properly, the epoxy tanks won't leak.
>
> Bob F.
> N200QK
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Darrell Daniels <log@...>
> To: Q-LIST@...
> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:19:03 PM
> Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks
>
> I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with the
> idea
> that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane .
I
> also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
> people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which
is
> not
> really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want
to
> burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
> The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
> about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
> places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any
other
> ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q
rebuild
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Quickie Builders Association WEB site
> http://www.quickiebuilders.org
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>









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Re: Fuel Tanks

Bob Farnam <bfarnam@...>
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...]On Behalf Of
Sam Hoskins
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 3:53 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


The archives will also show that "sloshing compound" is a big NO-NO.
Sloshing compound is for metal tanks, and I suspect a poor application,
even
there.

Like Bob F. said, paint on some extra epoxy. The standard epoxies ARE fuel
resistant.

I also used auto fuel for many years, now using 100LL exclusively. No fuel
degradation anywhere. I also use Urethane (Tygothane) fuel lines inside
the
cockpit. Don't use the clear vinyl lines, they harden over a short time.

[Bob Farnam]

Me too! Urethane lines hold up very well.

Bob F.
Sam

_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 10:19 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with the
idea

that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane . I
also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which is
not

really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want to
burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any other
ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q rebuild


Re: Fuel Tanks

Bob Farnam <bfarnam@...>
 

If nothing extra was done by the original builder, there is some chance that
it will leak. If you can't find out what was done during construction, then
I guess my next step would be to do a long term leakdown test. This can be
done by sealing up all of the openings except the supply line to the pump.
Then put an inflated balloon on the supply line and let it sit for 24 hours
to see if any volume is lost. Check all the seal points with soapy water. If
it is tight, go fly. If not, cut some holes and at least paint on more epoxy
inside. Unfortunately, the internal baffles mean that you will have to cut
holes into each section between the baffles. Hope that it passes the
leakdown test. Understand that a tiny amount of leakage into the fuse foam
won't hurt the foam, which is fuelproof. Only the Styrafoam in the wings is
at risk of dissolving. I recommend against any sealant except epoxy. I have
heard (but don't know firsthand) that some of the elastomer sealants are
attacked by auto fuel. Others on this list may know about that.
Incidentally, EZ-Poxy is supposed to be the modern equivalent of
Safe-T-Poxy. My 7.5 gallon aux. tank is made of EZ-Poxy and is fine after
about 7 years.

Good luck!

Bob F.
N200QK

-----Original Message-----
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...]On Behalf Of
Darrell Daniels
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 6:00 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I did not build my airplane so what would be your recommendation Would you
just put the auto fuel in and fly or cut some holes in the top of the tank
and seal it with something. Thanks Darrell
----- Original Message -----
From: <bfarnam@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 1:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

> Here's one more data point for you Darrell. My Q200 has been flying for
> more than 8 years using auto gas when I am at home and 100LL away on a
> trip. My tanks are made of Safe-T-Poxy. I have also had a sample of the
> tank material soaking in auto gas with MTBE for about 7 years. There is
no
> sign of softening or other problem. The main source of leakage that I
have
> seen is into the fuselage layup which typically had a lot of pinholes.
> Those can be sealed several ways during construction. Either sand and
> recoat with a fairly heavy layer of epoxy, or some have added another
> layer of glass. Mine is sealed with just an extra coating of epoxy. Done
> properly, the epoxy tanks won't leak.
>
> Bob F.
> N200QK
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Darrell Daniels <log@...>
> To: Q-LIST@...
> Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 8:19:03 PM
> Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks
>
> I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with the
> idea
> that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane .
I
> also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
> people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which is
> not
> really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want
to
> burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
> The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
> about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
> places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any other
> ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q
rebuild
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Quickie Builders Association WEB site
> http://www.quickiebuilders.org
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Re: Fuel Tanks

James Doyle <jdoyle1941@...>
 

Guys, When I built my Q I sanded the entire area where the tank was to be and put one layer of "B" glass on extending 1 inch beyond the tank and saturated it with safetypoxy. If the tank top is sealed with a liberal amount of epoxy and bedded well in flox. IT WILL NOT leak. I had 900+ hours with no leaks and I used auto fuel when ever possible. Sam is right, follow the plans.

Jim Doyle

----- Original Message -----
From: Dave Richardson
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 7:30 AM
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I recall hearing that Rutan and the EZ guys went to the very light
fiberglass cloth like they use on RC models to give the extra epoxy
coats on the inside of the tank some structure and to reduce the number
of pin holes. Perhaps Terry Crouch can comment on this or some of the
other guys familiar with the EZ's.

Dave Richardson

_____

From: Sam Hoskins [mailto:shoskins@...]
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 6:48 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

An aluminum tank makes absolutely no sense to me. What problem are you
trying to fix? Everything is there in the plans to get it right.

To keep the tank from developing pinhole leaks, paint on a couple extra
coats of epoxy, it's no big deal.

Geez - where do these wacky ideas come from?

Sam

_____

From: Q-LIST@... <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:
Q-LIST@... <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2006 1:11 AM
To: Q-LIST@... <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

I'm going to cut & shape the aluminium myself, but may get it
professionally
welded (& pressure tested)
I will then reconstruct the composite seat over the top so that the end
result will be an aluminium tank encapsulated in the original style
composite structure. Damian Gregory also recommends a bladder.
Allan F
Q2

----- Original Message -----
From: Darrell Daniels
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:41
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

Are you making your own aluminium tanks Darrell Daniels
----- Original Message -----
From: "Allan Farr" < afarr@... <mailto:afarr%40xtra.co> .
<mailto:afarr%40xtra.co.nz> nz>
To: <Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 12, 2006 11:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

>I have had the same thoughts, and after lots of excellent advice from
>various Q-Listers I am going for aluminium for my main tank. I will
leave
>some of the composite tank structure in place (front/sides/centre) so
as to

>not compromise structural integrity. It will weigh more but I'm only
57kg
>(9 st) so I don't care.
> Allan F
> Q2
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Darrell Daniels
> To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
> Sent: Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:19
> Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks
>
>
> I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with
the
> idea
> that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane
. I
> also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
> people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which
is
> not
> really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want
to
> burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
> The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
> about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
> places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any
other
> ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q
rebuild
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Quickie Builders Association WEB site
> http://www.quickieb < http://www.quickiebuilders.org
<http://www.quickiebuilders.org> > uilders.org
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>










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Re: Fuel Tanks

Webcave
 

Look at all the Ezes flying around with composite tanks and no problems.

Jack

-----Original Message-----
From: afarr@...
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Tue, 12 Sep 2006 11:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks


I have had the same thoughts, and after lots of excellent advice from various Q-Listers I am going for aluminium for my main tank. I will leave some of the composite tank structure in place (front/sides/centre) so as to not compromise structural integrity. It will weigh more but I'm only 57kg (9 st) so I don't care.
Allan F
Q2

----- Original Message -----
From: Darrell Daniels
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, 13 September 2006 15:19
Subject: [Q-LIST] Fuel Tanks

I have been searching the archives as I am still not satisfied with the idea
that fuel can leak through you tank and into the foam of you airplane . I
also wan to burn auto fuel . After all of my reading it seems the only
people who have actually done anything is using a slosh coating which is not
really practical it a Q but it seems to be the only option is you want to
burn car gas or rid of the possible fuel leak.
The one exception is in the Archive Sam in one entry said something
about using a fuel resistant epoxy but you could not get to all of the
places to sand to easily recoat the entire inside of the tank. Any other
ideas or am I making much to do for nothing Darrell Daniels Tri Q rebuild





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