Re: W and B

Chris Walterson

Jay----------   When the aircraft is empty and level it will nose over due to no tail weight. If install 20 lbs at the aft bulkhead I get

10 lbs on the tail station 214-------  373 on both mains at station 35.5.  I have inboard gear that is 21.5 inches back from the front of the firewall.

With my wife and no fuel we get 33lbs at 214    465 at 35.5 , pilot side and 425 at 35.5 passenger side.  Total 923 @ 41.8.

I'll get the certified scales and do the pilot and fuel loading as the guys have been suggesting.

Still having fun--------------  Chris

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Re: W and B

Jay Scheevel

Chris measure the FS’ again on your mains and tailwheel. Remembering forward face of firewall is FS 14. Post those FS numbers and all your weights on wheels with different loadings. I can double check your math. Sounds like more variation than I would expect.

Cheers,
Jay

On Jul 1, 2021, at 8:54 AM, Dave Dugas via groups.io <davedq2@...> wrote:

﻿I'd tighten up the light runners and run like hell if it were me and I posted my wife's weight.
Dave D

On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 10:39 AM, Chris Walterson
<dkeats@...> wrote:
What I am trying to do is to figure out how much ballast I will need
in the tail wheel area.

If I add twenty lbs as far back as I can,  I get 10 lbs on the tail
wheel, and 370 on the mains at station 35.5. [inboard gear]

This gives me a empty CG of 37.4.

I get my wife to jump in and she is 159.5 lbs with here heavy runners
on. According to her.

With this I have 33 lbs on tail wheel, 465 pilot side and 425 copilot
side.

Total 923 and Cg at 41.8.

If the header and mains are filled, mathematically  I get 1043 and CG
of 47.5 I will still do the actual Wand B with real fuel and real people
to make certain.

The problem I see is that if I hop in [ 190 lbs with light runners]
along with full fuel  I get 1233 Lbs , but the CG is 48.6. According to
the chart the CG wants to be 50 plus.

Does any one have their  Cg numbers at the higher weights.
1200------1300 ?

I am also doing the math, old school, with out a calculator. Don't use
it, you sure loose it.

Take care--------------  Chris

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Re: W and B

Dave Dugas

I'd tighten up the light runners and run like hell if it were me and I posted my wife's weight.
Dave D

On Thu, Jul 1, 2021 at 10:39 AM, Chris Walterson
<dkeats@...> wrote:
What I am trying to do is to figure out how much ballast I will need
in the tail wheel area.

If I add twenty lbs as far back as I can,  I get 10 lbs on the tail
wheel, and 370 on the mains at station 35.5. [inboard gear]

This gives me a empty CG of 37.4.

I get my wife to jump in and she is 159.5 lbs with here heavy runners
on. According to her.

With this I have 33 lbs on tail wheel, 465 pilot side and 425 copilot
side.

Total 923 and Cg at 41.8.

If the header and mains are filled, mathematically  I get 1043 and CG
of 47.5 I will still do the actual Wand B with real fuel and real people
to make certain.

The problem I see is that if I hop in [ 190 lbs with light runners]
along with full fuel  I get 1233 Lbs , but the CG is 48.6. According to
the chart the CG wants to be 50 plus.

Does any one have their  Cg numbers at the higher weights.
1200------1300 ?

I am also doing the math, old school, with out a calculator. Don't use
it, you sure loose it.

Take care--------------  Chris

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Re: W and B

Chris Walterson

What I am trying to do is to figure out how much ballast I will need in the tail wheel area.

If I add twenty lbs as far back as I can,  I get 10 lbs on the tail wheel, and 370 on the mains at station 35.5. [inboard gear]

This gives me a empty CG of 37.4.

I get my wife to jump in and she is 159.5 lbs with here heavy runners on. According to her.

With this I have 33 lbs on tail wheel, 465 pilot side and 425 copilot side.

Total 923 and Cg at 41.8.

If the header and mains are filled, mathematically  I get 1043 and CG of 47.5 I will still do the actual Wand B with real fuel and real people to make certain.

The problem I see is that if I hop in [ 190 lbs with light runners] along with full fuel  I get 1233 Lbs , but the CG is 48.6. According to the chart the CG wants to be 50 plus.

Does any one have their  Cg numbers at the higher weights. 1200------1300 ?

I am also doing the math, old school, with out a calculator. Don't use it, you sure loose it.

Take care--------------  Chris

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Re: W and B

Paul Fisher

I agree with Jay.  Weigh it empty, then climb in and weigh it again.  Then fill the main tank and weigh it, then fill the header, refill the main tank and weigh it again.  Then add some baggage and weigh it again.  With all of those numbers you can exactly calculate the arms of each of the items.  I would NOT use any published numbers for moment arms.  Math doesn't lie.

Just my opinion.

Paul Fisher
Q-200 N17PF

On Wed, Jun 30, 2021, 18:14 Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:
Chris,

I recommend you establish an empty CG FS and then go from there. Have a look at the W&B documents in the folder that Sam referenced on the group site. The FS of the tanks and the pilot/passenger (as well as the cargo area behind the seats), are best done by experiment on your aircraft. Weigh yourself, then hop in the airplane (while level) and have someone read the scales for you. Then fill the tanks in 2 gallon increments and do the same. This is easy to do and gives you the right answer for your plane. Most of the Tri-Q's are at or above 750, and they seem to fly, so I would not worry about the weight. I think that Reg Clarke's with the turbocharged Subaru engine was over 800 and I watched him fly it in and out of my 2600' long strip that is at 4650' MSL.

Cheers,
Jay

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Walterson
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2021 4:46 PM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] W and B

What are the exact moments for the stations on the plans built Q200? I see some places the moment for the pilot is 54.7 and then again another pilot position is  60.8. Is that custom built?  I also see the header at 23 and then at 24.

The empty weight is about 750. A bit chunky. Hopefully the extra HP will show.  Take care--------------- Chris

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Re: W and B

Jay Scheevel

Chris,

I recommend you establish an empty CG FS and then go from there. Have a look at the W&B documents in the folder that Sam referenced on the group site. The FS of the tanks and the pilot/passenger (as well as the cargo area behind the seats), are best done by experiment on your aircraft. Weigh yourself, then hop in the airplane (while level) and have someone read the scales for you. Then fill the tanks in 2 gallon increments and do the same. This is easy to do and gives you the right answer for your plane. Most of the Tri-Q's are at or above 750, and they seem to fly, so I would not worry about the weight. I think that Reg Clarke's with the turbocharged Subaru engine was over 800 and I watched him fly it in and out of my 2600' long strip that is at 4650' MSL.

Cheers,
Jay

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Chris Walterson
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2021 4:46 PM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] W and B

What are the exact moments for the stations on the plans built Q200? I see some places the moment for the pilot is 54.7 and then again another pilot position is 60.8. Is that custom built? I also see the header at 23 and then at 24.

The empty weight is about 750. A bit chunky. Hopefully the extra HP will show. Take care--------------- Chris

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Re: W and B

Chris Walterson

What are the exact moments for the stations on the plans built Q200?  I see some places the moment for the pilot is 54.7 and then again another pilot position is  60.8. Is that custom built?  I also see the header at 23 and then at 24.

The empty weight is about 750. A bit chunky. Hopefully the extra HP will show.  Take care--------------- Chris

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Re: Quickheads may have picked up a klingon.

smeshno1@...

I love "Jennifers" English syntax errors. In these scam phishing ploys it would be fun to reverse infect the
sub humans computers with the Klingon clip link in an endless loop.

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Paul Poulsen <paul.poulsen1957@...>
Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 2021 3:52 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Quickheads may have picked up a klingon.

On Wed, Jun 30, 2021 at 12:10 PM Bruce Crain <jcrain2@...> wrote:
I received an e mail from a Jennifer Spencer stating
```Your website or a website that your company hosts is infringing on a copyright protected
images owned by me personally.Do not open any of it!  Most likely spam!Bruce Crain```

--

Re: Quickheads may have picked up a klingon.

Paul Poulsen

On Wed, Jun 30, 2021 at 12:10 PM Bruce Crain <jcrain2@...> wrote:
I received an e mail from a Jennifer Spencer stating
```Your website or a website that your company hosts is infringing on a copyright protected
images owned by me personally.Do not open any of it!  Most likely spam!Bruce Crain```

--

Re: Quickheads may have picked up a klingon.

Rick Hole

I would ignore it entirely.  If this were a valid copyright notice it would provide the website in question and identify the specific image in claim.

Remember back when the Queen of Nigeria was desperately looking for a bank account to deposit \$40 million?  More of the same.

Rick Hole

Re: Quickheads may have picked up a klingon.

Jay Scheevel

Huh? What does that mean?

On Jun 29, 2021, at 8:10 PM, Bruce Crain <jcrain2@...> wrote:

﻿
I received an e mail from a Jennifer Spencer stating
```Your website or a website that your company hosts is infringing on a copyright protected
images owned by me personally.Do not open any of it!  Most likely spam!Bruce Crain```

Quickheads may have picked up a klingon.

Bruce Crain

I received an e mail from a Jennifer Spencer stating
```Your website or a website that your company hosts is infringing on a copyright protected
images owned by me personally.Do not open any of it!  Most likely spam!Bruce Crain```

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

Pete Stein

Dear friends, while you are there, please send positive vibes and prayers up for my husband, Pete Stein as he continues on is road to recovery.
Thank you so much.  Kim

On Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 15:12 Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:

It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,

Jay

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

Terry Crouch

Hi Jay,

I will be there at EAR. Leaving the Q at home. Planning on flying it to Enid.

Terry Crouch

-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Scheevel <jay@...>
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Sent: Tue, Jun 22, 2021 5:11 pm
Subject: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,
Jay

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

Kevin Boddicker

Capitol idea Jay. Look forward to it. Thanks for taking the lead on this.
Kevin

On Jun 23, 2021, at 10:39 AM, Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:

Sounds great Kevin. Missed seeing you at your fling. Maybe we can reserve the homebuilder patio this year and have a social hour. I will look into that.

Cheers,
Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Kevin Boddicker
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 8:15 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

Jeff and I plan to be there.

Kevin

On Jun 22, 2021, at 5:12 PM, Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:

﻿
It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,
Jay

Q-munity meet-up at OSH Airventure 2021

Jay Scheevel

Hi All,

I have reserved the Homebuilder’s patio for the timeslot 10am-Noon on Wednesday, July 28.  They told me that there is donut day until about 9:30 that day, so come early and you can get a donut!

Cheers,

Jay

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

That's great.  Looking forward to the chance to meet him.
I figured you'd have to be addicted to flying to go that far out of your way but....who knows.
Looking forward to a Q-munity gathering.
See ya at OSH

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>....
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2021 09:36:16 -0600

Hi Keith,

Would be great to see your spiffy T-18 again, but don’t feel pressured. I will not fly that far south, so probably can’t fly in together, but I need to introduce you to the brother of one of my good school chums. He flies one of 5 T-18’s that do an aerobatics routine in the southwest. He is in Las Vegas, and in the past several of that group have flown to OSH together. I think they are coming again this year and may pass near to you on the way. I will contact them and see if they are doing a Thorp group arrival. That would be something. In any case, I will get his contact phone to see if I can get you linked up while at the show.

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Keith Welsh
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 9:33 PM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

But not planning to at this time.  Presently down for annual and making more alterations.

Seems many of these planes were built venting the vac pump and engine down the gear legs....well guess what that does.

LOUSY BRAKES!  Obviously changing that.

And many were built w/o a static system.  Go figure!!  Installed an AV-30, static system and an OAT and absolutely luv it.

Plus a carb temp through the JPI 350.  Nice knowing density alt and now don't use carb ht much unless needed.

Interesting how much cooler the air is inside the carb and how much the temp climbs on final at idle.

Will see how July goes.

Why, are you thinking about flying into Terre Haute and partnering up?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2021 09:39:45 -0600

Will you be flying the Thorp, Keith?

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Keith Welsh
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 5:31 AM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

Yup...will be there camping.

Welsh

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2021 16:11:56 -0600

It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,

Jay

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

Jay Scheevel

Looking forward to seeing you there, Vern. I am waiting to hear back if we have a time/reservation for Hombuilder’s porch…standby.

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of smeshno1@...
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 12:10 PM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

Jay..

Penguin Vern will be at FOD this year.

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Corbin via groups.io <c_geiser@...>
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 10:23 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

I’ll do my best!!

Corbin

On Jun 24, 2021, at 10:20 AM, Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:

﻿

OK Corbin,  but no wimping out for Field of Dreams in Enid!

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Corbin via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 5:12 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

I will have to miss this year as well.  The new avionics will be finished but I’ll be in Washington DC that week.

Corbin

On Jun 23, 2021, at 10:34 PM, Keith Welsh <kw544@...> wrote:

﻿

But not planning to at this time.  Presently down for annual and making more alterations.

Seems many of these planes were built venting the vac pump and engine down the gear legs....well guess what that does.

LOUSY BRAKES!  Obviously changing that.

And many were built w/o a static system.  Go figure!!  Installed an AV-30, static system and an OAT and absolutely luv it.

Plus a carb temp through the JPI 350.  Nice knowing density alt and now don't use carb ht much unless needed.

Interesting how much cooler the air is inside the carb and how much the temp climbs on final at idle.

Will see how July goes.

Why, are you thinking about flying into Terre Haute and partnering up?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2021 09:39:45 -0600

Will you be flying the Thorp, Keith?

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Keith Welsh
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 5:31 AM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

Yup...will be there camping.

Welsh

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2021 16:11:56 -0600

It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,

Jay

--

Corbin
N121CG

--

Corbin
N121CG

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

smeshno1@...

Jay..

Penguin Vern will be at FOD this year.

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Corbin via groups.io <c_geiser@...>
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 10:23 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

I’ll do my best!!

Corbin

On Jun 24, 2021, at 10:20 AM, Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:

﻿

OK Corbin,  but no wimping out for Field of Dreams in Enid!

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Corbin via groups.io
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2021 5:12 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

I will have to miss this year as well.  The new avionics will be finished but I’ll be in Washington DC that week.

Corbin

On Jun 23, 2021, at 10:34 PM, Keith Welsh <kw544@...> wrote:

﻿

But not planning to at this time.  Presently down for annual and making more alterations.

Seems many of these planes were built venting the vac pump and engine down the gear legs....well guess what that does.

LOUSY BRAKES!  Obviously changing that.

And many were built w/o a static system.  Go figure!!  Installed an AV-30, static system and an OAT and absolutely luv it.

Plus a carb temp through the JPI 350.  Nice knowing density alt and now don't use carb ht much unless needed.

Interesting how much cooler the air is inside the carb and how much the temp climbs on final at idle.

Will see how July goes.

Why, are you thinking about flying into Terre Haute and partnering up?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2021 09:39:45 -0600

Will you be flying the Thorp, Keith?

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Keith Welsh
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 5:31 AM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

Yup...will be there camping.

Welsh

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2021 16:11:56 -0600

It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,

Jay

--

Corbin
N121CG

--

Corbin
N121CG

Re: Anyone going to OSH this year?

Jay Scheevel

Hi Keith,

Would be great to see your spiffy T-18 again, but don’t feel pressured. I will not fly that far south, so probably can’t fly in together, but I need to introduce you to the brother of one of my good school chums. He flies one of 5 T-18’s that do an aerobatics routine in the southwest. He is in Las Vegas, and in the past several of that group have flown to OSH together. I think they are coming again this year and may pass near to you on the way. I will contact them and see if they are doing a Thorp group arrival. That would be something. In any case, I will get his contact phone to see if I can get you linked up while at the show.

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Keith Welsh
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 9:33 PM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

But not planning to at this time.  Presently down for annual and making more alterations.

Seems many of these planes were built venting the vac pump and engine down the gear legs....well guess what that does.

LOUSY BRAKES!  Obviously changing that.

And many were built w/o a static system.  Go figure!!  Installed an AV-30, static system and an OAT and absolutely luv it.

Plus a carb temp through the JPI 350.  Nice knowing density alt and now don't use carb ht much unless needed.

Interesting how much cooler the air is inside the carb and how much the temp climbs on final at idle.

Will see how July goes.

Why, are you thinking about flying into Terre Haute and partnering up?

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2021 09:39:45 -0600

Will you be flying the Thorp, Keith?

Cheers,

Jay

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Keith Welsh
Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 2021 5:31 AM
To: main@Q-List.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?

Yup...will be there camping.

Welsh

---------- Original Message ----------
From: "Jay Scheevel" <jay@...>
To: <main@Q-List.groups.io>
Subject: [Q-List] Anyone going to OSH this year?
Date: Tue, 22 Jun 2021 16:11:56 -0600

It is my intension, should the weather gods permit, that I will be at Oshkosh with my Q this year. Is anyone else planning on going?  Is there a forum planned?

Cheers,

Jay

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