Date   

Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Mike Dwyer
 

FYI, I needed to place a 24 lb battery (PC925), behind the first bulkhead in the rear shell.  So the Q200 is very nose heavy as built.  It would be better to use a smaller battery closer to the front to save overall weight.  
On the motor mounts... To fit on the firewall the square base had to be modified anyway so this is not a precision part by any means!
Mike Dwyer Q200


On Wed, Feb 9, 2022, 9:58 PM Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:
My feeling is that the vertical CG and by association the center of thrust are not critical in affecting the handling or stability. I say this because the Tri-Q adds a good 50 pounds well below the aircraft center and still handles much like the tail dragger. Also, from my experience, best to keep the flying CG closer to the front of the envelope than the rear. My 2 cents.

Cheers,
Jay Scheevel, Tri-Q2 N8WQ, 201 hours 


On Feb 9, 2022, at 7:28 PM, Ian Ashdown <ian.ashdown@...> wrote:

I bought that download too.  I’m sure it’ll be useful at some point.  What is slightly aggravating is that the parts were obviously modeled in SolidWorks, so why not offer a SolidWorks  or .stp download.  I’d have paid a little more for that, but now I just have to model the parts all over again . . . in SolidWorks!

In the end I think the design of engine mounts are going to be driven by the type of AV Mount I select ( does anyone have any recommendations) and the spacing off the firewall, driven by the balance of the lighter engine.  I’m still not sure if the effect of moving CofG a few points rearward would be a positive or a negative.  I think negative as pilot, passenger and ‘luggage’ are all aft of the CofG, it may limit the max load capacity.

Then there is the question of the ‘thrust line’. I think I’d like to raise it (from the O-200 WL position)  for better packaging, but I’m not certain yet.  Would raising the thrust line 1”- 1.6” create handling issues?  I don’t know what the aircraft vertical CofG height is, maybe it’s in some of the documentation . . .

Lots to figure out!

Ian
SoCal


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Ian Ashdown
 

Jay,

Ive done vertical CofG calculations on race cars the same way.  Unfortunately I don’t have a physical aircraft to work from, just some empirical data and calculations.

I feel reasonably comfortable that the thrust line +/- 1” or so should not change the characteristics too much.  I’m going to go forward designing the engine mounting system based on the best packaging.  The standard Rotax silencer is quite large, maybe re-designing something a bit flatter would allow me to lower the engine closer  to the O-200 thrust line.

Ian


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Ian Ashdown
 

You did indeed!  And it was helpful.  But there is still some doubt about the datum’s.  I’m going to try some things to see if I can get some better guidance.

Ian


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Ian Ashdown
 

Yes, exactly!  The inconsistencies are difficult to navigate!


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Michael Dunning
 

I also did a measurement of the difference between the thrust line of the Revmaster and the O200. They are not the same. Will see if I can find that also.

I just posted it a couple of days ago: Revmaster and O-200 Thrust Lines. Still an open question on the inclusive vs. exclusive of fuselage thickness until I get out to the hangar, though. The Q-200 firewall Appendix sheet seems to include the fuselage thickness while the Q2 plans say to place the Q2 firewall template inside the fuselage shells; both firewall templates have the same OML dimensions...
--
-MD
#2827 (still thinking about planning on visualizing how to finish building)


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Jay Scheevel
 

I computed the vertical position of my empty CG when I was doing my weigh and balance by changing the angle of the fuselage from zero and recording the difference in scales and FS’s, then computed the vertical CG from those. I will see if I can dig that up. I also did a measurement of the difference between the thrust line of the Revmaster and the O200. They are not the same. Will see if I can find that also. 

Cheers,
Jay


On Feb 9, 2022, at 9:03 PM, Ian Ashdown <ian.ashdown@...> wrote:

I don’t believe the design O-200 thrust line is WL 15” but the only dimensional reference I’ve found states that it is 7.6” (I think) from the top of the firewall.  Don’t you love the use of consistent datum’s!  My question is, is that the firewall panel (inside of the Fuse) or the outside of the fuse at the FS 14” (firewall)?

Very confusing/frustrating!

Ian
SoCal


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Ian Ashdown
 

I don’t believe the design O-200 thrust line is WL 15” but the only dimensional reference I’ve found states that it is 7.6” (I think) from the top of the firewall.  Don’t you love the use of consistent datum’s!  My question is, is that the firewall panel (inside of the Fuse) or the outside of the fuse at the FS 14” (firewall)?

Very confusing/frustrating!

Ian
SoCal


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Michael Dunning
 

Thanks for the info, Jay. Nice to have additional data points.

Ian,
I have a thread over on the Q-Performance list talking about some possible alternative engines. I have the same question, since oddly enough the Aeromomentum engines want to be an extra 1.5 inches down from the O-200 location in order to maintain the stock over-the-nose sightlines.

I have not seen a vertical C.G. documented anywhere in the plans. However, the Q-200 plans specifically mention placing the thrust line on W.L. 15, which does not correspond to any other jigging or mold lines... I can only infer that W.L. 15 may in fact be the as-designed vertical CG, but we will likely never know. 
--
-MD
#2827 (still thinking about planning on visualizing how to finish building)


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Jay Scheevel
 

My feeling is that the vertical CG and by association the center of thrust are not critical in affecting the handling or stability. I say this because the Tri-Q adds a good 50 pounds well below the aircraft center and still handles much like the tail dragger. Also, from my experience, best to keep the flying CG closer to the front of the envelope than the rear. My 2 cents.

Cheers,
Jay Scheevel, Tri-Q2 N8WQ, 201 hours 


On Feb 9, 2022, at 7:28 PM, Ian Ashdown <ian.ashdown@...> wrote:

I bought that download too.  I’m sure it’ll be useful at some point.  What is slightly aggravating is that the parts were obviously modeled in SolidWorks, so why not offer a SolidWorks  or .stp download.  I’d have paid a little more for that, but now I just have to model the parts all over again . . . in SolidWorks!

In the end I think the design of engine mounts are going to be driven by the type of AV Mount I select ( does anyone have any recommendations) and the spacing off the firewall, driven by the balance of the lighter engine.  I’m still not sure if the effect of moving CofG a few points rearward would be a positive or a negative.  I think negative as pilot, passenger and ‘luggage’ are all aft of the CofG, it may limit the max load capacity.

Then there is the question of the ‘thrust line’. I think I’d like to raise it (from the O-200 WL position)  for better packaging, but I’m not certain yet.  Would raising the thrust line 1”- 1.6” create handling issues?  I don’t know what the aircraft vertical CofG height is, maybe it’s in some of the documentation . . .

Lots to figure out!

Ian
SoCal


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Ian Ashdown
 

I bought that download too.  I’m sure it’ll be useful at some point.  What is slightly aggravating is that the parts were obviously modeled in SolidWorks, so why not offer a SolidWorks  or .stp download.  I’d have paid a little more for that, but now I just have to model the parts all over again . . . in SolidWorks!

In the end I think the design of engine mounts are going to be driven by the type of AV Mount I select ( does anyone have any recommendations) and the spacing off the firewall, driven by the balance of the lighter engine.  I’m still not sure if the effect of moving CofG a few points rearward would be a positive or a negative.  I think negative as pilot, passenger and ‘luggage’ are all aft of the CofG, it may limit the max load capacity.

Then there is the question of the ‘thrust line’. I think I’d like to raise it (from the O-200 WL position)  for better packaging, but I’m not certain yet.  Would raising the thrust line 1”- 1.6” create handling issues?  I don’t know what the aircraft vertical CofG height is, maybe it’s in some of the documentation . . .

Lots to figure out!

Ian
SoCal


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Jay Scheevel
 

I think the drawing that I sent you the link for should be sufficient to create a Cad model for fabrication. They are not complex or high tolerance parts.

Cheers,
Jay


On Feb 9, 2022, at 6:58 PM, Michael Dunning <dunningme@...> wrote:

I checked the copy of the metal parts files I bought last week and can confirm the engine mounts are NOT contained in any of the drawings. Bummer. 
--
-MD
#2827 (still thinking about planning on visualizing how to finish building)


Re: Q2/200 Engine mounts

Michael Dunning
 

I checked the copy of the metal parts files I bought last week and can confirm the engine mounts are NOT contained in any of the drawings. Bummer. 
--
-MD
#2827 (still thinking about planning on visualizing how to finish building)


Re: New Member Introduction

Robert Cringely
 

VNE in my Q1 is Mach 0.3. My Xavion screen can display it. 

On Tue, Feb 8, 2022 at 7:26 PM Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:
This is the Q-list.  Realize your sending this to 500 people who are here and are interested in Q aircraft.  It's ok for an introduction but please stick to Q's.  I didn't subscribe to the mach meter list.
Mike Dwyer Q200

On Tue, Feb 8, 2022, 7:11 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 Well..of course the mach warning has to be tested. The 50 will also. :-)   

One of the options on the forward cabin closet display was a mach indicator. 

 Some funny stories come from being in the delivery side of Biz Jets.  I once had an acceptance flight on a Falcon 10 and the buyer was complaining he could stand up in it... and my response was he couldn't normally stand up in his Rolls Royce either.  He accepted the delivery!  

 I left the company in 1981 to return to my birth city of Wichita.  Had an offer to work on a then secret program at Raytheon Beechcraft. It ended up being something called the Starship 1... and I was on the R&D crew that built the first three mockups and the first three flight test aircraft. I flew NC2 on a rotation crew mostly over MCI.  That is where I met Rutan and the crew also working on Voyager.  Went to Boeing Wichita in 1985 when it was obvious the Starship was going to be a loosing program.   


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 5:44 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I think that was Arkansas Aeromotive, which was owned by BaE. My parents lived in Arkansas and saw me more often when I lived in the UK than later when I moved to California. 

My company is looking for one or more Falcon 10s right now. Neil and I used to fly those, too. Twice, while deadheading back from Paris, we took it supersonic over the Channel. You couldn't do that in a Hawker pointed straight at the ground.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 3:33 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 The worst part of entering the senior years as an aviator..loss of friends. At the time I was Private rated at Falcon..but also one of the Lead A&P. At times Dassault would expect a visit. France is where I had my first training in Composite aircraft field repair since the Falcon 50 was the first aircraft we had that included composite construction control surfaces. All of us at FalconJet in Little Rock were random selected to fly on either squawk flights or customer acceptance. Requiring the mechanics to fly had a definite encouraging factor to be certain the aircraft was airworthy. If a floor mechanic refused they were terminated on the spot, no matter what experience level they had. No secret, it was well known prior to an offer for employment that random flight duty would be required.   

 It was my time in the barrel so to speak in a bigger way due to the fact I was the Lead A&P on the first Falcon 50 of the program, so I had to be the trainer of our people in the States after my stint in Europe. Many trips followed..

 My wife who is Russian, has on her list of places to visit, Paris France. I've been avoiding that trip!  Outside of the Capitol it is pleasant but I have no romantic ideas of Paris. Not particularly fond of the Frenchies attitude toward others, at least as it was in the late 1970's and early 1980's.

 I asked because Little Rock Airmotive was the next door neighbor to our facility and if my memory is not too clouded over they were working the Hawker aircraft.  Perhaps sometime we can chat a bit about the times there.

Vern      


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 5:05 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I guess I worked directly for BaE. I was the dumb right-seater to RAF test pilot and European Aerobatic Champion Neil Williams. We became friends at the Shuttleworth Collection where he was a display pilot and I was an apprentice. Nearly every weekend had us flying a jet somewhere -- that is until Neil and his lovely wife flew an He-111 bomber into the side of a mountain... After that I moved back to the USA.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 12:10 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 Which company were you with then? Made that journey a few times in a Falcon..both 20 and 50 to and from Little Rock.  Looking down at Greenland/Iceland and the wide open waters between even at Flight Levels is a serious undertaking. I can only imagine what a single engine at the Glasair speeds must have been like..and that is where it will stay for me too.. in my imagine :-o

 Flying Europe might be a fun challenge in a US homebuilt tho..take the cargo ship with the airplane. 

Vern   

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 11:58 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I once flew my old Glasair to the UK and back in the 1980s. The immersion suit mandated by Canadian regs was ghastly. I had made the flight 100+ times delivering Hawkers to Little Rock but that doesn’t prepare you at all for that many hours and miles over water in a sliver of fiberglass. I never did it again. 


Re: First flight 2022

One Sky Dog
 

Kevin,

I forgot to tell you Jon F flew in on his way to Phoenix area yesterday. We had a nice lunch an could not help discussing how nice the weather is in the area.

Charlie

On Tuesday, February 8, 2022, 6:19 PM, Kevin Boddicker <trumanst@...> wrote:

WEEEELLLLL I made my first flight of the year this afternoon.
Even it was a BFR in a C172, I got in the air. Was also out of biannual, so two birds one stone.
I had'nt  flown since mid Oct. Rust was removed quickly.
I didn’t even think about flying with my left hand till I was on the way home.
Old dog, same tricks.

Press forward boldly!!!




Kevin Boddicker
TriQ 200 N7868B  570 hrs
Luana, IA.









Re: First flight 2022

One Sky Dog
 

Kevin,

It was good you could get your first flight in. I would have to go get my logbook to tell you how many flights I have gotten in 2022. We got some snow on the mountain peaks but it melted off pretty quick.

It has been in the 50’s with the last storm pushing down but it is expected to be 70 by Friday. Dave and I are planning on going to Copperstate fly-in. We will be doing airport camping at Buckeye 73-45 temps.

I have planned my route to 2022 FOD. Now to get the final details cleaned up and test fly. I have to wait until the white stuff goes away from Ogden before I can continue working on the Dragonfly.

Stay warm up there,

On Tuesday, February 8, 2022, 6:19 PM, Kevin Boddicker <trumanst@...> wrote:

WEEEELLLLL I made my first flight of the year this afternoon.
Even it was a BFR in a C172, I got in the air. Was also out of biannual, so two birds one stone.
I had'nt  flown since mid Oct. Rust was removed quickly.
I didn’t even think about flying with my left hand till I was on the way home.
Old dog, same tricks.

Press forward boldly!!!




Kevin Boddicker
TriQ 200 N7868B  570 hrs
Luana, IA.









Re: First flight 2022

Paul Fisher
 

Congratulations Kevin.  Now get that tri-Q back in the air!!

Paul

On Tue, Feb 8, 2022, 19:19 Kevin Boddicker <trumanst@...> wrote:
WEEEELLLLL I made my first flight of the year this afternoon.
Even it was a BFR in a C172, I got in the air. Was also out of biannual, so two birds one stone.
I had'nt  flown since mid Oct. Rust was removed quickly.
I didn’t even think about flying with my left hand till I was on the way home.
Old dog, same tricks.

Press forward boldly!!!




Kevin Boddicker
TriQ 200 N7868B   570 hrs
Luana, IA.









Re: New Member Introduction

Mike Dwyer
 

This is the Q-list.  Realize your sending this to 500 people who are here and are interested in Q aircraft.  It's ok for an introduction but please stick to Q's.  I didn't subscribe to the mach meter list.
Mike Dwyer Q200

On Tue, Feb 8, 2022, 7:11 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 Well..of course the mach warning has to be tested. The 50 will also. :-)   

One of the options on the forward cabin closet display was a mach indicator. 

 Some funny stories come from being in the delivery side of Biz Jets.  I once had an acceptance flight on a Falcon 10 and the buyer was complaining he could stand up in it... and my response was he couldn't normally stand up in his Rolls Royce either.  He accepted the delivery!  

 I left the company in 1981 to return to my birth city of Wichita.  Had an offer to work on a then secret program at Raytheon Beechcraft. It ended up being something called the Starship 1... and I was on the R&D crew that built the first three mockups and the first three flight test aircraft. I flew NC2 on a rotation crew mostly over MCI.  That is where I met Rutan and the crew also working on Voyager.  Went to Boeing Wichita in 1985 when it was obvious the Starship was going to be a loosing program.   


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 5:44 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I think that was Arkansas Aeromotive, which was owned by BaE. My parents lived in Arkansas and saw me more often when I lived in the UK than later when I moved to California. 

My company is looking for one or more Falcon 10s right now. Neil and I used to fly those, too. Twice, while deadheading back from Paris, we took it supersonic over the Channel. You couldn't do that in a Hawker pointed straight at the ground.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 3:33 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 The worst part of entering the senior years as an aviator..loss of friends. At the time I was Private rated at Falcon..but also one of the Lead A&P. At times Dassault would expect a visit. France is where I had my first training in Composite aircraft field repair since the Falcon 50 was the first aircraft we had that included composite construction control surfaces. All of us at FalconJet in Little Rock were random selected to fly on either squawk flights or customer acceptance. Requiring the mechanics to fly had a definite encouraging factor to be certain the aircraft was airworthy. If a floor mechanic refused they were terminated on the spot, no matter what experience level they had. No secret, it was well known prior to an offer for employment that random flight duty would be required.   

 It was my time in the barrel so to speak in a bigger way due to the fact I was the Lead A&P on the first Falcon 50 of the program, so I had to be the trainer of our people in the States after my stint in Europe. Many trips followed..

 My wife who is Russian, has on her list of places to visit, Paris France. I've been avoiding that trip!  Outside of the Capitol it is pleasant but I have no romantic ideas of Paris. Not particularly fond of the Frenchies attitude toward others, at least as it was in the late 1970's and early 1980's.

 I asked because Little Rock Airmotive was the next door neighbor to our facility and if my memory is not too clouded over they were working the Hawker aircraft.  Perhaps sometime we can chat a bit about the times there.

Vern      


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 5:05 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I guess I worked directly for BaE. I was the dumb right-seater to RAF test pilot and European Aerobatic Champion Neil Williams. We became friends at the Shuttleworth Collection where he was a display pilot and I was an apprentice. Nearly every weekend had us flying a jet somewhere -- that is until Neil and his lovely wife flew an He-111 bomber into the side of a mountain... After that I moved back to the USA.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 12:10 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 Which company were you with then? Made that journey a few times in a Falcon..both 20 and 50 to and from Little Rock.  Looking down at Greenland/Iceland and the wide open waters between even at Flight Levels is a serious undertaking. I can only imagine what a single engine at the Glasair speeds must have been like..and that is where it will stay for me too.. in my imagine :-o

 Flying Europe might be a fun challenge in a US homebuilt tho..take the cargo ship with the airplane. 

Vern   

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 11:58 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I once flew my old Glasair to the UK and back in the 1980s. The immersion suit mandated by Canadian regs was ghastly. I had made the flight 100+ times delivering Hawkers to Little Rock but that doesn’t prepare you at all for that many hours and miles over water in a sliver of fiberglass. I never did it again. 


First flight 2022

Kevin Boddicker
 

WEEEELLLLL I made my first flight of the year this afternoon.
Even it was a BFR in a C172, I got in the air. Was also out of biannual, so two birds one stone.
I had'nt flown since mid Oct. Rust was removed quickly.
I didn’t even think about flying with my left hand till I was on the way home.
Old dog, same tricks.

Press forward boldly!!!




Kevin Boddicker
TriQ 200 N7868B 570 hrs
Luana, IA.


Re: New Member Introduction

Frankenbird Vern
 

 Well..of course the mach warning has to be tested. The 50 will also. :-)   

One of the options on the forward cabin closet display was a mach indicator. 

 Some funny stories come from being in the delivery side of Biz Jets.  I once had an acceptance flight on a Falcon 10 and the buyer was complaining he could stand up in it... and my response was he couldn't normally stand up in his Rolls Royce either.  He accepted the delivery!  

 I left the company in 1981 to return to my birth city of Wichita.  Had an offer to work on a then secret program at Raytheon Beechcraft. It ended up being something called the Starship 1... and I was on the R&D crew that built the first three mockups and the first three flight test aircraft. I flew NC2 on a rotation crew mostly over MCI.  That is where I met Rutan and the crew also working on Voyager.  Went to Boeing Wichita in 1985 when it was obvious the Starship was going to be a loosing program.   


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 5:44 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I think that was Arkansas Aeromotive, which was owned by BaE. My parents lived in Arkansas and saw me more often when I lived in the UK than later when I moved to California. 

My company is looking for one or more Falcon 10s right now. Neil and I used to fly those, too. Twice, while deadheading back from Paris, we took it supersonic over the Channel. You couldn't do that in a Hawker pointed straight at the ground.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 3:33 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 The worst part of entering the senior years as an aviator..loss of friends. At the time I was Private rated at Falcon..but also one of the Lead A&P. At times Dassault would expect a visit. France is where I had my first training in Composite aircraft field repair since the Falcon 50 was the first aircraft we had that included composite construction control surfaces. All of us at FalconJet in Little Rock were random selected to fly on either squawk flights or customer acceptance. Requiring the mechanics to fly had a definite encouraging factor to be certain the aircraft was airworthy. If a floor mechanic refused they were terminated on the spot, no matter what experience level they had. No secret, it was well known prior to an offer for employment that random flight duty would be required.   

 It was my time in the barrel so to speak in a bigger way due to the fact I was the Lead A&P on the first Falcon 50 of the program, so I had to be the trainer of our people in the States after my stint in Europe. Many trips followed..

 My wife who is Russian, has on her list of places to visit, Paris France. I've been avoiding that trip!  Outside of the Capitol it is pleasant but I have no romantic ideas of Paris. Not particularly fond of the Frenchies attitude toward others, at least as it was in the late 1970's and early 1980's.

 I asked because Little Rock Airmotive was the next door neighbor to our facility and if my memory is not too clouded over they were working the Hawker aircraft.  Perhaps sometime we can chat a bit about the times there.

Vern      


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 5:05 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I guess I worked directly for BaE. I was the dumb right-seater to RAF test pilot and European Aerobatic Champion Neil Williams. We became friends at the Shuttleworth Collection where he was a display pilot and I was an apprentice. Nearly every weekend had us flying a jet somewhere -- that is until Neil and his lovely wife flew an He-111 bomber into the side of a mountain... After that I moved back to the USA.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 12:10 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 Which company were you with then? Made that journey a few times in a Falcon..both 20 and 50 to and from Little Rock.  Looking down at Greenland/Iceland and the wide open waters between even at Flight Levels is a serious undertaking. I can only imagine what a single engine at the Glasair speeds must have been like..and that is where it will stay for me too.. in my imagine :-o

 Flying Europe might be a fun challenge in a US homebuilt tho..take the cargo ship with the airplane. 

Vern   

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 11:58 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I once flew my old Glasair to the UK and back in the 1980s. The immersion suit mandated by Canadian regs was ghastly. I had made the flight 100+ times delivering Hawkers to Little Rock but that doesn’t prepare you at all for that many hours and miles over water in a sliver of fiberglass. I never did it again. 


Re: New Member Introduction

Robert Cringely
 

I think that was Arkansas Aeromotive, which was owned by BaE. My parents lived in Arkansas and saw me more often when I lived in the UK than later when I moved to California. 

My company is looking for one or more Falcon 10s right now. Neil and I used to fly those, too. Twice, while deadheading back from Paris, we took it supersonic over the Channel. You couldn't do that in a Hawker pointed straight at the ground.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 3:33 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 The worst part of entering the senior years as an aviator..loss of friends. At the time I was Private rated at Falcon..but also one of the Lead A&P. At times Dassault would expect a visit. France is where I had my first training in Composite aircraft field repair since the Falcon 50 was the first aircraft we had that included composite construction control surfaces. All of us at FalconJet in Little Rock were random selected to fly on either squawk flights or customer acceptance. Requiring the mechanics to fly had a definite encouraging factor to be certain the aircraft was airworthy. If a floor mechanic refused they were terminated on the spot, no matter what experience level they had. No secret, it was well known prior to an offer for employment that random flight duty would be required.   

 It was my time in the barrel so to speak in a bigger way due to the fact I was the Lead A&P on the first Falcon 50 of the program, so I had to be the trainer of our people in the States after my stint in Europe. Many trips followed..

 My wife who is Russian, has on her list of places to visit, Paris France. I've been avoiding that trip!  Outside of the Capitol it is pleasant but I have no romantic ideas of Paris. Not particularly fond of the Frenchies attitude toward others, at least as it was in the late 1970's and early 1980's.

 I asked because Little Rock Airmotive was the next door neighbor to our facility and if my memory is not too clouded over they were working the Hawker aircraft.  Perhaps sometime we can chat a bit about the times there.

Vern      


From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 5:05 PM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I guess I worked directly for BaE. I was the dumb right-seater to RAF test pilot and European Aerobatic Champion Neil Williams. We became friends at the Shuttleworth Collection where he was a display pilot and I was an apprentice. Nearly every weekend had us flying a jet somewhere -- that is until Neil and his lovely wife flew an He-111 bomber into the side of a mountain... After that I moved back to the USA.



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 12:10 PM <smeshno1@...> wrote:
 Which company were you with then? Made that journey a few times in a Falcon..both 20 and 50 to and from Little Rock.  Looking down at Greenland/Iceland and the wide open waters between even at Flight Levels is a serious undertaking. I can only imagine what a single engine at the Glasair speeds must have been like..and that is where it will stay for me too.. in my imagine :-o

 Flying Europe might be a fun challenge in a US homebuilt tho..take the cargo ship with the airplane. 

Vern   

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> on behalf of Robert Cringely <bob@...>
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 11:58 AM
To: main@q-list.groups.io <main@q-list.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Q-List] New Member Introduction
 
I once flew my old Glasair to the UK and back in the 1980s. The immersion suit mandated by Canadian regs was ghastly. I had made the flight 100+ times delivering Hawkers to Little Rock but that doesn’t prepare you at all for that many hours and miles over water in a sliver of fiberglass. I never did it again. 

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