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W&B questions

HawkiDoug@...
 

My flight adviser & I were reviewing my W&B numbers and we are confused. The
graph that Quickie had in their ops manual has two lines going from lower
left to upper right. They call this the Operating CG Envelope. Why the two
lines? When we compared this graph to another from a RV6 or Cessna, there is
only one line. The reason we ask is as I take weight out of my Q2 (LS1
canard), the CG moves forward but to the right of the right line. I would
have to but alot of weight up front to get it within the envelope. I have a
24 lb battery at an arm of 114 but even if I move it to the bagage area I'm
still right of the CG envelope. Even if I put in a 6 lb. battery it doesn't
work. CG continues to move forward but not far enough. Things get better
when I put a passenger in. What gives with the two lines? My bird has flown
with a 14 lb. lighter RevMaster engine at 1100lb. gross (so the log book
says). Is my bird save to fly????

Thanks!
Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE

terry.l.sickler@...
 

Hawkeye,
Are you using theQ-200 envelope or the Q-2 envelope? The two lines represent
the two limits, forward and aft. The Q-200 (LS-1) has a forward limit of
41.5 inches and a aft limit of 47.3 inches as measured from the datum which
is 14" forward of the firewall leading edge. ~T~

-----Original Message-----
From: HawkiDoug@... [SMTP:HawkiDoug@...]
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2000 5:11 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions

My flight adviser & I were reviewing my W&B numbers and we are confused.
The
graph that Quickie had in their ops manual has two lines going from lower
left to upper right. They call this the Operating CG Envelope. Why the
two
lines? When we compared this graph to another from a RV6 or Cessna, there
is
only one line. The reason we ask is as I take weight out of my Q2 (LS1
canard), the CG moves forward but to the right of the right line. I would

have to but alot of weight up front to get it within the envelope. I have
a
24 lb battery at an arm of 114 but even if I move it to the bagage area
I'm
still right of the CG envelope. Even if I put in a 6 lb. battery it
doesn't
work. CG continues to move forward but not far enough. Things get better

when I put a passenger in. What gives with the two lines? My bird has
flown
with a 14 lb. lighter RevMaster engine at 1100lb. gross (so the log book
says). Is my bird save to fly????

Thanks!
Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




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Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

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HawkiDoug@...
 

In a message dated 8/21/00 12:45:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
terry.l.sickler@... writes:

<< Hawkeye,
Are you using theQ-200 envelope or the Q-2 envelope? The two lines represent
the two limits, forward and aft. The Q-200 (LS-1) has a forward limit of
41.5 inches and a aft limit of 47.3 inches as measured from the datum which
is 14" forward of the firewall leading edge. ~T~ >>

Terry I am using the Q200 numbers as I have the LS1 canard. I have not
changed anything to the original bird except put on a heavier VW Type 4
engine. My numbers are below.

Empty LM = 315.5 arm=36.75
RM = 313.5
TW = 26.25 arm=205.5 (Just forward of TW) (Original weight
was 641 w/Revmaster)

Calculated pos.
Main tank arm=45.93
Header arm=28.14 (4 gal. max.)
Pilot/Pass. arm=59.63 (I weigh 200lbs.)
bagage arm=85.17
battery arm=114 @ 24.5lbs. (could be replaced w/ a 6lb bat.)

I have ran several examples where I've replaced my battery with the 6lb. one
I saw at OSH and even moved it to the bagage compartment. I'm still tail
heavy. The ELT is in the back but only represents a couple of pounds. (yes
it could be moved) The strobe/position light power source is in the back as
well but also only represents a couple of pounds. Both are forward of the
battery (positions unknown exactly)

Again, there is a log that shows that the plane has been flown at 1086lbs.
This is the second time we weighed my bird and I feel we did it right.
Leveled it and measured it from the firewall and added 14" etc.

Any sugestions? I will probably will be moving the battery and ELT forward,
but it still seems tail heavy.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE

kittleson1@...
 

Doug,

With you in the plane and gas in the header, (no battery) , I get:

879 lbs at CG of 46.8 "

I have my battery on the inside of the firewall.....Looks like you may
have to move it somewhere close to there also to make it work.

That is one heavy battery...subtract the cables etc and I bet you can
loose 10 lbs with a lighter one on the firewall.

Are you sure that your header CG is only 12" aft of the firewall?

46" seems to be a long way aft for the main fuel tank, as does 60" for
the people. I don't think there's 14" difference between your butt and
the fuel....and it all seems to be too far aft to be correct.....

I don't have my logs here at home, but from tidbits of info I had left
laying around, these numbers seem to be too far aft....what does the
manual say?

Al


Mon, 21 Aug 2000 14:40:45 EDT HawkiDoug@... writes:
In a message dated 8/21/00 12:45:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
terry.l.sickler@... writes:

<< Hawkeye,
Are you using theQ-200 envelope or the Q-2 envelope? The two lines
represent
the two limits, forward and aft. The Q-200 (LS-1) has a forward
limit of
41.5 inches and a aft limit of 47.3 inches as measured from the
datum which
is 14" forward of the firewall leading edge. ~T~ >>

Terry I am using the Q200 numbers as I have the LS1 canard. I have
not
changed anything to the original bird except put on a heavier VW
Type 4
engine. My numbers are below.

Empty LM = 315.5 arm=36.75
RM = 313.5
TW = 26.25 arm=205.5 (Just forward of TW)
(Original weight
was 641 w/Revmaster)

Calculated pos.
Main tank arm=45.93
Header arm=28.14 (4 gal. max.)
Pilot/Pass. arm=59.63 (I weigh 200lbs.)
bagage arm=85.17
battery arm=114 @ 24.5lbs. (could be replaced w/ a 6lb
bat.)

I have ran several examples where I've replaced my battery with the
6lb. one
I saw at OSH and even moved it to the bagage compartment. I'm still
tail
heavy. The ELT is in the back but only represents a couple of
pounds. (yes
it could be moved) The strobe/position light power source is in the
back as
well but also only represents a couple of pounds. Both are forward
of the
battery (positions unknown exactly)

Again, there is a log that shows that the plane has been flown at
1086lbs.
This is the second time we weighed my bird and I feel we did it
right.
Leveled it and measured it from the firewall and added 14" etc.

Any sugestions? I will probably will be moving the battery and ELT
forward,
but it still seems tail heavy.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE



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Quickie Builders Association WEB site
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Michael D. Callahan <micallahan@...>
 

Doug,
Sounds like you have inadvertently added an extra couple of inches in
there. The firewall sits at 14" aft of datum. Your header tank would be
against the back of the instrument panel if its center of gravity was at
28.14 (fourteen inches aft of the firewall to the center of the tank). I
have been doing some W&B lately and I agree with Al, those numbers sound a
couple of inches too long. Mike C.

----- Original Message -----
From: <HawkiDoug@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 1:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


In a message dated 8/21/00 12:45:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
terry.l.sickler@... writes:

<< Hawkeye,
Are you using theQ-200 envelope or the Q-2 envelope? The two lines
represent
the two limits, forward and aft. The Q-200 (LS-1) has a forward limit of
41.5 inches and a aft limit of 47.3 inches as measured from the datum
which
is 14" forward of the firewall leading edge. ~T~ >>

Terry I am using the Q200 numbers as I have the LS1 canard. I have not
changed anything to the original bird except put on a heavier VW Type 4
engine. My numbers are below.

Empty LM = 315.5 arm=36.75
RM = 313.5
TW = 26.25 arm=205.5 (Just forward of TW) (Original
weight
was 641 w/Revmaster)

Calculated pos.
Main tank arm=45.93
Header arm=28.14 (4 gal. max.)
Pilot/Pass. arm=59.63 (I weigh 200lbs.)
bagage arm=85.17
battery arm=114 @ 24.5lbs. (could be replaced w/ a 6lb bat.)

I have ran several examples where I've replaced my battery with the 6lb.
one
I saw at OSH and even moved it to the bagage compartment. I'm still tail
heavy. The ELT is in the back but only represents a couple of pounds.
(yes
it could be moved) The strobe/position light power source is in the back
as
well but also only represents a couple of pounds. Both are forward of the
battery (positions unknown exactly)

Again, there is a log that shows that the plane has been flown at 1086lbs.
This is the second time we weighed my bird and I feel we did it right.
Leveled it and measured it from the firewall and added 14" etc.

Any sugestions? I will probably will be moving the battery and ELT
forward,
but it still seems tail heavy.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html


HawkiDoug@...
 

In a message dated 8/21/00 8:44:17 PM Central Daylight Time,
kittleson1@... writes:

<< Doug,

With you in the plane and gas in the header, (no battery) , I get:

879 lbs at CG of 46.8 "

I have my battery on the inside of the firewall.....Looks like you may
have to move it somewhere close to there also to make it work.

That is one heavy battery...subtract the cables etc and I bet you can
loose 10 lbs with a lighter one on the firewall.

Are you sure that your header CG is only 12" aft of the firewall?

46" seems to be a long way aft for the main fuel tank, as does 60" for
the people. I don't think there's 14" difference between your butt and
the fuel....and it all seems to be too far aft to be correct.....

I don't have my logs here at home, but from tidbits of info I had left
laying around, these numbers seem to be too far aft....what does the
manual say?

Al >>

Hi Al! The empty weights I gave included the 24.4 lb. battery. Empty weight
without battery is 630.81 with a cg of 40.84. Then you can add the 24.4 lb.
battery back in at an arm of 112.5. As far as my positions go, I have the
LS1 canard and I called Paul Fisher yesterday and my positions are very
similar to his. His engine is heavier so his numbers look better. After
reviewing all this I'm going to get a lighter battery and move it and my ELT
to the bagage compartment and go on a diet. I am re-naming the bagage
compartment to air compartment and everything should be better.

Did you mount your battery inside the cowling? Everyone I've spoke to has
told me it is too hot for a battery there. What kind of battery do you use
and how much does it weigh? etc.

Thanks for your comments. They help alot!!!!

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE

HawkiDoug@...
 

In a message dated 8/22/00 11:39:26 AM Central Daylight Time,
james@... writes:

<< Hawkeye,

My Q2 showed weight and balance was near the aft limit with me and full fuel
and behind the aft CG limit with a passenger. However, when I flew it I
found that it flys nose heavy. I have to use my reflexor during all
operations except cruise. I have the GU canard. My balance is 305 lbs on
each main and 20 lbs on the tail empty.

You can do some testing by doing the "unstick test". This is a take off
with max back stick. This will give you some idea of the flying balance.
Use different reflexor positions. Essential to reduce power to or near idle
when take off speed is near to prevent actual flight. My unstick speed is
63 mph.

James Postma >>

Thanks for your comments James! I just talked to one of the previous owners
who has the Mech. ticket for my bird (his partner was the test pilot). We
were discussing this W&B issue. He said with the Revmaster they had to
reflex the tail down to acheive optimum speed. I did find in the log book a
note that "best speed with 5 degrees up reflexor". I assume this means
ailerons up; tail down which would be consistant with the other owners
comments. He even said they flew this Q2 at 200 lbs. over gross and it flew
"OK". Back then this would mean 1300 lbs. I found no log of this.

If this was you bird, what would you do? I am willing to move the battery
forward and get the lighter battery. But does this mean I will likely have
to put more up reflex in and cause drag?? Again, I have a heavier VW type 4
engine (14lbs.) on the front replacing the Revmaster.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE

James Postma <james@...>
 

Hawkeye,

My Q2 showed weight and balance was near the aft limit with me and full fuel
and behind the aft CG limit with a passenger. However, when I flew it I
found that it flys nose heavy. I have to use my reflexor during all
operations except cruise. I have the GU canard. My balance is 305 lbs on
each main and 20 lbs on the tail empty.

You can do some testing by doing the "unstick test". This is a take off
with max back stick. This will give you some idea of the flying balance.
Use different reflexor positions. Essential to reduce power to or near idle
when take off speed is near to prevent actual flight. My unstick speed is
63 mph.

James Postma
james@...
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT (GMT-8) voice

----- Original Message -----
From: <HawkiDoug@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2000 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


In a message dated 8/21/00 12:45:56 PM Central Daylight Time,
terry.l.sickler@... writes:

<< Hawkeye,
Are you using theQ-200 envelope or the Q-2 envelope? The two lines
represent
the two limits, forward and aft. The Q-200 (LS-1) has a forward limit of
41.5 inches and a aft limit of 47.3 inches as measured from the datum
which
is 14" forward of the firewall leading edge. ~T~ >>

Terry I am using the Q200 numbers as I have the LS1 canard. I have not
changed anything to the original bird except put on a heavier VW Type 4
engine. My numbers are below.

Empty LM = 315.5 arm=36.75
RM = 313.5
TW = 26.25 arm=205.5 (Just forward of TW) (Original
weight
was 641 w/Revmaster)

Calculated pos.
Main tank arm=45.93
Header arm=28.14 (4 gal. max.)
Pilot/Pass. arm=59.63 (I weigh 200lbs.)
bagage arm=85.17
battery arm=114 @ 24.5lbs. (could be replaced w/ a 6lb bat.)

I have ran several examples where I've replaced my battery with the 6lb.
one
I saw at OSH and even moved it to the bagage compartment. I'm still tail
heavy. The ELT is in the back but only represents a couple of pounds.
(yes
it could be moved) The strobe/position light power source is in the back
as
well but also only represents a couple of pounds. Both are forward of the
battery (positions unknown exactly)

Again, there is a log that shows that the plane has been flown at 1086lbs.
This is the second time we weighed my bird and I feel we did it right.
Leveled it and measured it from the firewall and added 14" etc.

Any sugestions? I will probably will be moving the battery and ELT
forward,
but it still seems tail heavy.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html

James Postma <james@...>
 

Hawkeye,

I recommend that you fly it as is. But try the unstick test series first.
You want to make sure that you can get the canard off first with full
reflexor. Looking at your weights they look very good. You put 14 lbs more
in the nose; you do not want to move any more weight forward.

James Postma
james@...
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT (GMT-8) voice

----- Original Message -----
From: <HawkiDoug@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


In a message dated 8/22/00 11:39:26 AM Central Daylight Time,
james@... writes:

<< Hawkeye,

My Q2 showed weight and balance was near the aft limit with me and full
fuel
and behind the aft CG limit with a passenger. However, when I flew it I
found that it flys nose heavy. I have to use my reflexor during all
operations except cruise. I have the GU canard. My balance is 305 lbs
on
each main and 20 lbs on the tail empty.

You can do some testing by doing the "unstick test". This is a take off
with max back stick. This will give you some idea of the flying balance.
Use different reflexor positions. Essential to reduce power to or near
idle
when take off speed is near to prevent actual flight. My unstick speed
is
63 mph.

James Postma >>

Thanks for your comments James! I just talked to one of the previous
owners
who has the Mech. ticket for my bird (his partner was the test pilot). We
were discussing this W&B issue. He said with the Revmaster they had to
reflex the tail down to acheive optimum speed. I did find in the log book
a
note that "best speed with 5 degrees up reflexor". I assume this means
ailerons up; tail down which would be consistant with the other owners
comments. He even said they flew this Q2 at 200 lbs. over gross and it
flew
"OK". Back then this would mean 1300 lbs. I found no log of this.

If this was you bird, what would you do? I am willing to move the battery
forward and get the lighter battery. But does this mean I will likely
have
to put more up reflex in and cause drag?? Again, I have a heavier VW
type 4
engine (14lbs.) on the front replacing the Revmaster.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




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Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html

Bruce Crain
 

Hawkeye,
I am going to give you some numbers that were crunched on my Q200. I
figured some of the arms by using the POH and working the math backwards
somehow. If you have the new canard the final weights and moments should
be added up in 2 separate columns and then filled in to give you a point
on the graph. The final CG arm is not used in this situation to figure
weights and balances,,, just the graph.
WEIGHT ARM
MOMENT
EMPTY WT 704 40.2
28303.06
OIL A/C weighed with full oil
FUEL (header) 30 24
720
FUEL (main) 75 44.0
3300
PILOT 175 55.14
9650
PASSENGER 0
0
BAGGAGE 40 78
3120
TOTAL 1024
45093.06

Find 1024 lbs gross weight going up the left side of the graph and
intersect the moment inch lbs X 1000 45093.06. You will find that the
point is well in the middle of the fore and aft lines that run
diagonally. Again the LS1 Canard has a different chart than the GU
Canard. I don't know if this helps but thought it was worth a try. As
you can see the gross arm wasn't used as in a production aircraft. Just
the graph. Somebody spank me if I am wrong but I've been flying
everything from "Fat Folks" to "No Folks" and have not had a problem
(except for pilot induced "wild rides")

Bruce Crain

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James Postma <james@...>
 

Hawkeye,

The gross for a Revmaster Q2 is 1,000 lbs. 200 over would be 1,200 not
1,300. Would not want to be in one at 1,300. I have seen one fly at 1,200
and it is marginal; about 150 fpm climb rate. This at sea level. I think
the practical maximum is 1,100 with the Revmaster. At 150 mph and 900
gross, I use 0 degrees reflexor. 5 up sounds reasonable. You will need
more with the type 4. You may want to move weight back for optimum cruise,
but get it flying safely first.

Have you flown it with the Revmaster? What is your HP?

James Postma
james@...
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT (GMT-8) voice

----- Original Message -----
From: <HawkiDoug@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


Thanks for your comments James! I just talked to one of the previous
owners
who has the Mech. ticket for my bird (his partner was the test pilot). We
were discussing this W&B issue. He said with the Revmaster they had to
reflex the tail down to acheive optimum speed. I did find in the log book
a
note that "best speed with 5 degrees up reflexor". I assume this means
ailerons up; tail down which would be consistant with the other owners
comments. He even said they flew this Q2 at 200 lbs. over gross and it
flew
"OK". Back then this would mean 1300 lbs. I found no log of this.

If this was you bird, what would you do? I am willing to move the battery
forward and get the lighter battery. But does this mean I will likely
have
to put more up reflex in and cause drag?? Again, I have a heavier VW
type 4
engine (14lbs.) on the front replacing the Revmaster.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




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Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html

daveq2@...
 

James,
Your numbers sound very similar to mine. I also have the Revmaster and have to use reflexor for all take offs and landings. I trim with reflexor so that it flies level at 100 mph and I have plenty of back stick left for slowing down for landings. Even with a passenger I have to use reflexor because the main wing is so effective. In level flight, solo, with zero degrees reflexor, my elevators are down about 2-3 degrees, with passenger the elevators are almost neutral, as is the reflexor. With a passenger I also found that my stall speed increased by about 5 mph...but no more than that. My Q2 weighs 723 lbs. with full fuel (20 gallons). I've flown it at 1085 lbs. and it flew fine but I'd like to practice a lot with that much weight because it seems to be asking a lot out of a 65 hp engine. I hope that this helps answer a couple of Hawkeye's questions. Dave Dugas

At 03:09 PM 08/22/2000 -0700, you wrote:
Hawkeye,

The gross for a Revmaster Q2 is 1,000 lbs. 200 over would be 1,200 not
1,300. Would not want to be in one at 1,300. I have seen one fly at 1,200
and it is marginal; about 150 fpm climb rate. This at sea level. I think
the practical maximum is 1,100 with the Revmaster. At 150 mph and 900
gross, I use 0 degrees reflexor. 5 up sounds reasonable. You will need
more with the type 4. You may want to move weight back for optimum cruise,
but get it flying safely first.

Have you flown it with the Revmaster? What is your HP?

James Postma
james@...
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT (GMT-8) voice
----- Original Message -----
From: <HawkiDoug@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


Thanks for your comments James! I just talked to one of the previous
owners
who has the Mech. ticket for my bird (his partner was the test pilot). We
were discussing this W&B issue. He said with the Revmaster they had to
reflex the tail down to acheive optimum speed. I did find in the log book
a
note that "best speed with 5 degrees up reflexor". I assume this means
ailerons up; tail down which would be consistant with the other owners
comments. He even said they flew this Q2 at 200 lbs. over gross and it
flew
"OK". Back then this would mean 1300 lbs. I found no log of this.

If this was you bird, what would you do? I am willing to move the battery
forward and get the lighter battery. But does this mean I will likely
have
to put more up reflex in and cause drag?? Again, I have a heavier VW
type 4
engine (14lbs.) on the front replacing the Revmaster.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html





To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html




kittleson1@...
 

Doug,

Sorry about the error.

I get, you in the plane, gas in the header, no battery: 855# at 45 "
Add battery
879#at 46.8"

looks like that battery is a BIG tie breaker.

I have mine mounted on the inside (cockpit) side of the firewall, right
side, above one of the
stiffeners. It's a B&C battery and I think it weighs about 17#.

It would be the answer to your baggage area carrying more than air.

The wires to the engine aren't more than about 3 feet long. It really
helps to keep the line loss down
at the high current times. Spins the engine very well.

Good luck,

Al


On Tue, 22 Aug 2000 09:25:01 EDT HawkiDoug@... writes:
In a message dated 8/21/00 8:44:17 PM Central Daylight Time,
kittleson1@... writes:

<< Doug,

With you in the plane and gas in the header, (no battery) , I get:

879 lbs at CG of 46.8 "

I have my battery on the inside of the firewall.....Looks like you
may
have to move it somewhere close to there also to make it work.

That is one heavy battery...subtract the cables etc and I bet you
can
loose 10 lbs with a lighter one on the firewall.

Are you sure that your header CG is only 12" aft of the firewall?

46" seems to be a long way aft for the main fuel tank, as does 60"
for
the people. I don't think there's 14" difference between your butt
and
the fuel....and it all seems to be too far aft to be correct.....

I don't have my logs here at home, but from tidbits of info I had
left
laying around, these numbers seem to be too far aft....what does
the
manual say?

Al >>

Hi Al! The empty weights I gave included the 24.4 lb. battery.
Empty weight
without battery is 630.81 with a cg of 40.84. Then you can add the
24.4 lb.
battery back in at an arm of 112.5. As far as my positions go, I
have the
LS1 canard and I called Paul Fisher yesterday and my positions are
very
similar to his. His engine is heavier so his numbers look better.
After
reviewing all this I'm going to get a lighter battery and move it
and my ELT
to the bagage compartment and go on a diet. I am re-naming the
bagage
compartment to air compartment and everything should be better.

Did you mount your battery inside the cowling? Everyone I've spoke
to has
told me it is too hot for a battery there. What kind of battery do
you use
and how much does it weigh? etc.

Thanks for your comments. They help alot!!!!

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE



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HawkiDoug@...
 

In a message dated 8/22/00 9:45:55 PM Central Daylight Time, daveq2@...
writes:

<< Your numbers sound very similar to mine. I also have the Revmaster and
have to use reflexor for all take offs and landings. I trim with reflexor so
that it flies level at 100 mph and I have plenty of back stick left for
slowing down for landings. Even with a passenger I have to use reflexor
because the main wing is so effective. In level flight, solo, with zero
degrees reflexor, my elevators are down about 2-3 degrees, with passenger the
elevators are almost neutral, as is the reflexor. With a passenger I also
found that my stall speed increased by about 5 mph...but no more than that.
My Q2 weighs 723 lbs. with full fuel (20 gallons). I've flown it at 1085
lbs. and it flew fine but I'd like to practice a lot with that much weight
because it seems to be asking a lot out of a 65 hp engine. I hope that this
helps answer a couple of Hawkeye's questions. Dave Dugas >>

Thanks for the comments Dave!! What canard type do you have?? GU or LS1?

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE

HawkiDoug@...
 

In a message dated 8/23/00 12:55:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
james@... writes:

<< Do you have the LS1 canard on a Q2 Revmaster? The canard can carry more
weight but the Revmaster may not climb with it over 1,200 lbs. The LS1 was
required for the Q200.

James Postma >>
Jim-The original owners had a Revmaster on a Q2 w/the LS1 canard. I'm
installing a VW type 4 engine now.

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE

James Postma <james@...>
 

Thanks Dave,

I found that if I fly cruise with the elevator at 0 degrees it is more
efficient than with the reflexor at 0 degrees. Sounds like our birds are
just right. What climb rate did you get at 1085 weight?

Hawkeye,

Do you have the LS1 canard on a Q2 Revmaster? The canard can carry more
weight but the Revmaster may not climb with it over 1,200 lbs. The LS1 was
required for the Q200.

James Postma
james@...
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT (GMT-8) voice

----- Original Message -----
From: <daveq2@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 4:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


James,
Your numbers sound very similar to mine. I also have the Revmaster
and have to use reflexor for all take offs and landings. I trim with
reflexor so that it flies level at 100 mph and I have plenty of back stick
left for slowing down for landings. Even with a passenger I have to use
reflexor because the main wing is so effective. In level flight, solo,
with zero degrees reflexor, my elevators are down about 2-3 degrees, with
passenger the elevators are almost neutral, as is the reflexor. With a
passenger I also found that my stall speed increased by about 5 mph...but no
more than that. My Q2 weighs 723 lbs. with full fuel (20 gallons). I've
flown it at 1085 lbs. and it flew fine but I'd like to practice a lot with
that much weight because it seems to be asking a lot out of a 65 hp engine.
I hope that this helps answer a couple of Hawkeye's questions. Dave Dugas


At 03:09 PM 08/22/2000 -0700, you wrote:
Hawkeye,

The gross for a Revmaster Q2 is 1,000 lbs. 200 over would be 1,200 not
1,300. Would not want to be in one at 1,300. I have seen one fly at
1,200
and it is marginal; about 150 fpm climb rate. This at sea level. I
think
the practical maximum is 1,100 with the Revmaster. At 150 mph and 900
gross, I use 0 degrees reflexor. 5 up sounds reasonable. You will need
more with the type 4. You may want to move weight back for optimum
cruise,
but get it flying safely first.

daveq2@...
 

Hawk...I have the LS1. Dave D.

At 09:22 AM 08/23/2000 EDT, you wrote:
In a message dated 8/22/00 9:45:55 PM Central Daylight Time, daveq2@...
writes:

<< Your numbers sound very similar to mine. I also have the Revmaster and
have to use reflexor for all take offs and landings. I trim with reflexor so
that it flies level at 100 mph and I have plenty of back stick left for
slowing down for landings. Even with a passenger I have to use reflexor
because the main wing is so effective. In level flight, solo, with zero
degrees reflexor, my elevators are down about 2-3 degrees, with passenger the
elevators are almost neutral, as is the reflexor. With a passenger I also
found that my stall speed increased by about 5 mph...but no more than that.
My Q2 weighs 723 lbs. with full fuel (20 gallons). I've flown it at 1085
lbs. and it flew fine but I'd like to practice a lot with that much weight
because it seems to be asking a lot out of a 65 hp engine. I hope that this
helps answer a couple of Hawkeye's questions. Dave Dugas >>

Thanks for the comments Dave!! What canard type do you have?? GU or LS1?

Doug "Hawkeye" Humble
Omaha NE




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Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html




daveq2@...
 

James,
I think less elevator = less drag. I noticed higher cruise speeds when the elevators were closer to 0 deg. At 1085 lbs Revmaster, climb rate is about 400 ft/min. OAT was about 80 degrees F. I'm going to try to make it to Ottawa in Oct. I've gat a stuck valve now so today's project is fixing that. I had the same problem on the #3 cyl exhaust, now it's the #1 exhaust valve. The engine sat for 17 years and so far no other trouble. I should probably ream all of the valve guides but maybe #s 2 and 4 will be OK. Besides, I can't wait to go flyin' again. Dave Dugas

At 09:56 AM 08/23/2000 -0700, you wrote:
Thanks Dave,

I found that if I fly cruise with the elevator at 0 degrees it is more
efficient than with the reflexor at 0 degrees. Sounds like our birds are
just right. What climb rate did you get at 1085 weight?

Hawkeye,

Do you have the LS1 canard on a Q2 Revmaster? The canard can carry more
weight but the Revmaster may not climb with it over 1,200 lbs. The LS1 was
required for the Q200.

James Postma
james@...
(253) 584-1182 9:00 to 8:00 PDT (GMT-8) voice
----- Original Message -----
From: <daveq2@...>
To: <Q-LIST@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 4:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: W&B questions


James,
Your numbers sound very similar to mine. I also have the Revmaster
and have to use reflexor for all take offs and landings. I trim with
reflexor so that it flies level at 100 mph and I have plenty of back stick
left for slowing down for landings. Even with a passenger I have to use
reflexor because the main wing is so effective. In level flight, solo,
with zero degrees reflexor, my elevators are down about 2-3 degrees, with
passenger the elevators are almost neutral, as is the reflexor. With a
passenger I also found that my stall speed increased by about 5 mph...but no
more than that. My Q2 weighs 723 lbs. with full fuel (20 gallons). I've
flown it at 1085 lbs. and it flew fine but I'd like to practice a lot with
that much weight because it seems to be asking a lot out of a 65 hp engine.
I hope that this helps answer a couple of Hawkeye's questions. Dave Dugas


At 03:09 PM 08/22/2000 -0700, you wrote:
Hawkeye,

The gross for a Revmaster Q2 is 1,000 lbs. 200 over would be 1,200 not
1,300. Would not want to be in one at 1,300. I have seen one fly at
1,200
and it is marginal; about 150 fpm climb rate. This at sea level. I
think
the practical maximum is 1,100 with the Revmaster. At 150 mph and 900
gross, I use 0 degrees reflexor. 5 up sounds reasonable. You will need
more with the type 4. You may want to move weight back for optimum
cruise,
but get it flying safely first.





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Q-LIST-unsubscribe@...

Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://web2.airmail.net/qba321tm/q-page1.html




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