fire extinguishing system


Allan Farr <afarr@...>
 

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system



The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Allan Farr <afarr@...>
 

Hi Peter. I will be able to extract the hinge pin from my side hinged canopy from the inside (haven't figured out how yet), so that if inverted on the ground I will hopefully be able to push the canopy sideways. I'll also carry a Plexiglas shattering tool (axe?).
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:11
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system


I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

Sounds OK I will have a look at mine. If you find a lead I am interested in
your suggestion for an automatic fire extinguisher.

Cheers

Peter



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 5:37 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system



Hi Peter. I will be able to extract the hinge pin from my side hinged canopy
from the inside (haven't figured out how yet), so that if inverted on the
ground I will hopefully be able to push the canopy sideways. I'll also carry
a Plexiglas shattering tool (axe?).
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:11
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Allan Farr <afarr@...>
 

I can't find anything on the internet re the fire extinguishing system, but I remember seeing it on telly several years ago.
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:46
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system


Sounds OK I will have a look at mine. If you find a lead I am interested in
your suggestion for an automatic fire extinguisher.

Cheers

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 5:37 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Hi Peter. I will be able to extract the hinge pin from my side hinged canopy
from the inside (haven't figured out how yet), so that if inverted on the
ground I will hopefully be able to push the canopy sideways. I'll also carry
a Plexiglas shattering tool (axe?).
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:11
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

I'll have a look also.

Cheers

Peter



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 6:06 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system



I can't find anything on the internet re the fire extinguishing system, but
I remember seeing it on telly several years ago.
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:46
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Sounds OK I will have a look at mine. If you find a lead I am interested in
your suggestion for an automatic fire extinguisher.

Cheers

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 5:37 PM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Hi Peter. I will be able to extract the hinge pin from my side hinged canopy
from the inside (haven't figured out how yet), so that if inverted on the
ground I will hopefully be able to push the canopy sideways. I'll also carry
a Plexiglas shattering tool (axe?).
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:11
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Steve <sham@...>
 

This might be a good subject....the last three or four fatalities have been caused by fire. As far as a release system for the canopy....I believe a impact tool to break is the only reasonable way of escape a inverted bird.


Steve Ham

----- Original Message -----
From: Allan Farr
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 4:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system


I can't find anything on the internet re the fire extinguishing system, but I remember seeing it on telly several years ago.
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:46
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Sounds OK I will have a look at mine. If you find a lead I am interested in
your suggestion for an automatic fire extinguisher.

Cheers

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 5:37 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Hi Peter. I will be able to extract the hinge pin from my side hinged canopy
from the inside (haven't figured out how yet), so that if inverted on the
ground I will hopefully be able to push the canopy sideways. I'll also carry
a Plexiglas shattering tool (axe?).
Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:11
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter

_____

From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr


Larry Severson
 

if the occupants are trapped
I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It is mounted high above/between the seats.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@...


Mike Dwyer <mdwyer@...>
 

One problem I see with a Halon type extinguisher is that you may suffocate... I carry a big camping knife secured on my left side arm rest to break the canopy if need be. Does double duty as a survival knife.
Happy Flyin,
Mike

Steve wrote:

This might be a good subject....the last three or four fatalities have been caused by fire. As far as a release system for the canopy....I believe a impact tool to break is the only reasonable way of escape a inverted bird.


Steve Ham






----- Original Message -----
From: Allan Farr To: Q-LIST@... Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 4:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system


I can't find anything on the internet re the fire extinguishing system, but I remember seeing it on telly several years ago. Regards
Allan

----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris To: Q-LIST@... Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:46
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Sounds OK I will have a look at mine. If you find a lead I am interested in
your suggestion for an automatic fire extinguisher.

Cheers

Peter

_____
From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 5:37 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

Hi Peter. I will be able to extract the hinge pin from my side hinged canopy
from the inside (haven't figured out how yet), so that if inverted on the
ground I will hopefully be able to push the canopy sideways. I'll also carry
a Plexiglas shattering tool (axe?).
Regards
Allan
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Harris To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 19:11
Subject: RE: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

I think that idea is worth a follow up Allan, also some thought how to get
out when the canopy is held closed under the weight of the hull.

Peter

_____
From: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
[mailto:Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
Of
Allan Farr
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2007 2:43 PM
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Subject: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an
automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago
which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is
pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the
plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire
retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may
save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr












Quickie Builders Association WEB site
http://www.quickiebuilders.org

Yahoo! Groups Links






Mike Dwyer <mdwyer@...>
 

That would work if the fire was in the engine compartment but after a crash I worry more about one of the fuel tanks rupturing or a fuel line separating. Have you seen these fire hoods that give you a couple of minutes of air. You could set off a halon extinguisher after putting on the fire hood. http://www.thetravelinsider.info/travelaccessories/evacu8smokehood.htm
Maybe a general discussion of safety items and safe operating procedures is in order...

Mike Q200 N3QP




Allan Farr wrote:

The recent crash & burn tragedy got me wondering if anyone has considered an automatic fire extinguishing system. I heard of a system for cars awhile ago which utilzes a plastic tube mounted under the bonnet (hood) which is pressurised by an activated fire extinguisher. If there is a fire the plastic tube melts causing the extinguisher to discharge the foam/fire retardant in exactly the right location. It's a very simple system which may save a life, especially if the occupants are trapped and/or unconcious.
Allan Farr



James Doyle <jdoyle1941@...>
 

I always kept a small folding crash axe strapped to my shoulder harness. Thank goodness I never had need for it.

Jim Doyle

----- Original Message -----
From: larry severson
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system



>if the occupants are trapped

I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It
is mounted high above/between the seats.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@...


Jim Patillo
 

Larry,

Since Phil Lankford with a "K" is the only Q-Pilot I know of that
survived a serious crash in which he and his wife had gas all over them
and lived to talk about it, I thought he might be a good place to
start. I've talked with Phil at some length and we both agree
installing a crash hammer in the cockpit may create a false sense of
security. Its like pissing in the wind, its kind of fun but doesn't get
you anywhere.

1). You presume you will be conscious enough to use a hammer and 2).
that a crash hammer would even work. Have you ever tried breaking out a
rounded lexan canopy so that you know it works? Has anyone? I'm
convinced this is an area that needs to be addressed NOW by some of our
resident wizards. I love my airplane but I am very concerned about this
negative scenerio. It can happen to anyone regardless of their
abilities.

I designed my canopy with a simple quick disconnect system that allows
it to be jettisoned in a couple of seconds. This may save me in an
inflight to ground situation like Phil's but does nothing for a landing
that goes bad and inverts the plane quickly with me going unconscious.
Phil said when he was upside down, he unlatched his belt, rolled around
and got his feet on the ground and pushed the plane up and off of him
and Sherry. He didn't feel a crash hammer would have done much good.
Luckily for him, the canopy already ripped off. In fact he was very
happy the canopy was gone.

I believe the problem is serious enough, it's time we collectively came
up with a solution that would be best treated like an AD.

There have simply been to many people burned up in these planes.

Regards,
Jim Patillo

P.S. I don't express my views much anymore on this site but this one
needs to be addressed and resolved!

--- In Q-LIST@..., larry severson <larry2@...> wrote:


if the occupants are trapped
I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It
is mounted high above/between the seats.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@...


Sam Hoskins
 

On my 15th flight I went inverted on the ground. The canopy smashed and I
had grass in my face. Some kind souls ran out and lifted the plane off of
me.

IMHO a hammer would do no good. I do carry a very aggressive backpacker's
saw, but I'm sure it would take 20 minutes or so to hack any kind of opening
that might do any good but I figure it's better than nothing. You would
have to go sideways and that won't be easy.

Sam

On 3/28/07, Jim Patillo <logistics_engineering@...> wrote:

Larry,

Since Phil Lankford with a "K" is the only Q-Pilot I know of that
survived a serious crash in which he and his wife had gas all over them
and lived to talk about it, I thought he might be a good place to
start. I've talked with Phil at some length and we both agree
installing a crash hammer in the cockpit may create a false sense of
security. Its like pissing in the wind, its kind of fun but doesn't get
you anywhere.

1). You presume you will be conscious enough to use a hammer and 2).
that a crash hammer would even work. Have you ever tried breaking out a
rounded lexan canopy so that you know it works? Has anyone? I'm
convinced this is an area that needs to be addressed NOW by some of our
resident wizards. I love my airplane but I am very concerned about this
negative scenerio. It can happen to anyone regardless of their
abilities.

I designed my canopy with a simple quick disconnect system that allows
it to be jettisoned in a couple of seconds. This may save me in an
inflight to ground situation like Phil's but does nothing for a landing
that goes bad and inverts the plane quickly with me going unconscious.
Phil said when he was upside down, he unlatched his belt, rolled around
and got his feet on the ground and pushed the plane up and off of him
and Sherry. He didn't feel a crash hammer would have done much good.
Luckily for him, the canopy already ripped off. In fact he was very
happy the canopy was gone.

I believe the problem is serious enough, it's time we collectively came
up with a solution that would be best treated like an AD.

There have simply been to many people burned up in these planes.

Regards,
Jim Patillo

P.S. I don't express my views much anymore on this site but this one
needs to be addressed and resolved!


--- In Q-LIST@... <Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com>, larry severson
<larry2@...> wrote:


if the occupants are trapped
I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It
is mounted high above/between the seats.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@...

--
Sam Hoskins
www.MistakeProofing.Net
618-967-0016 ph.
312-212-4086 fax


JMasal@...
 

I reported my Q1 crash in QTALK. Gas all over my legs and belted too tight
to reach the switches. I saw 2 bubble canopy crashes at Oshkosh which both lit
up. If they light up you can only say your last prayers. But if it doesn't
light up and you have crashed outside the confines of civilization you better
have something to cut your way out as you should have plenty of time to do so.

j



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


Mike Perry <dmperry1012@...>
 

Just a note of caution before anyone starts experimenting:

Mark Waddelow died experimenting with Halon. (Pretty sure that's
documented in an old Q-Talk but couldn't locate it tonite.) Halon is not
particularly dangerous, but it displaces oxygen in a closed space. As Mike
Dwyer said: "One problem I see with a Halon type extinguisher is that you
may suffocate."

Be careful.

Mike Perry


Larry Severson
 

I designed my canopy with a simple quick disconnect system that allows
it to be jettisoned in a couple of seconds.
Important, my basic Q2 has that. Unfortunately, my triQ does not.

This may save me in an
inflight to ground situation like Phil's but does nothing for a landing
that goes bad and inverts the plane quickly with me going unconscious.
Unconscious is out of luck.

Phil said when he was upside down, he unlatched his belt, rolled around
and got his feet on the ground and pushed the plane up and off of him
and Sherry.
A hard surface crash breaks the canopy. A plowed field probably will not.

He didn't feel a crash hammer would have done much good.
A poor tool that will work some of the time is better than none.
However, the canopy is 1/8inch lexan(?) that is fairly rigidly help in the canopy frame. A non mounted canopy clearly would not break with the small crash hammer that I have, but the rigid installation should. A sharp axe would be better. And the Navy issues heavy knife like devices for just such a purpose for canopies that are far stronger/thicker.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@...


Terry Adams
 

Thankfully my plane has a roll bar. Thankfully I had a hatchet. I went inverted on landing once, popped the seat belt, and then broke out the cracked canopy which allowed me to crawl out. Though the airport crash truck arrived, if a fire had started it would have been too late to save me. JM2C

Terry

----- Original Message -----
From: Sam Hoskins
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: fire extinguishing system


On my 15th flight I went inverted on the ground. The canopy smashed and I
had grass in my face. Some kind souls ran out and lifted the plane off of
me.

IMHO a hammer would do no good. I do carry a very aggressive backpacker's
saw, but I'm sure it would take 20 minutes or so to hack any kind of opening
that might do any good but I figure it's better than nothing. You would
have to go sideways and that won't be easy.

Sam

On 3/28/07, Jim Patillo <logistics_engineering@...> wrote:
>
> Larry,
>
> Since Phil Lankford with a "K" is the only Q-Pilot I know of that
> survived a serious crash in which he and his wife had gas all over them
> and lived to talk about it, I thought he might be a good place to
> start. I've talked with Phil at some length and we both agree
> installing a crash hammer in the cockpit may create a false sense of
> security. Its like pissing in the wind, its kind of fun but doesn't get
> you anywhere.
>
> 1). You presume you will be conscious enough to use a hammer and 2).
> that a crash hammer would even work. Have you ever tried breaking out a
> rounded lexan canopy so that you know it works? Has anyone? I'm
> convinced this is an area that needs to be addressed NOW by some of our
> resident wizards. I love my airplane but I am very concerned about this
> negative scenerio. It can happen to anyone regardless of their
> abilities.
>
> I designed my canopy with a simple quick disconnect system that allows
> it to be jettisoned in a couple of seconds. This may save me in an
> inflight to ground situation like Phil's but does nothing for a landing
> that goes bad and inverts the plane quickly with me going unconscious.
> Phil said when he was upside down, he unlatched his belt, rolled around
> and got his feet on the ground and pushed the plane up and off of him
> and Sherry. He didn't feel a crash hammer would have done much good.
> Luckily for him, the canopy already ripped off. In fact he was very
> happy the canopy was gone.
>
> I believe the problem is serious enough, it's time we collectively came
> up with a solution that would be best treated like an AD.
>
> There have simply been to many people burned up in these planes.
>
> Regards,
> Jim Patillo
>
> P.S. I don't express my views much anymore on this site but this one
> needs to be addressed and resolved!
>
>
> --- In Q-LIST@... <Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com>, larry severson
> <larry2@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> > >if the occupants are trapped
> >
> > I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It
> > is mounted high above/between the seats.
> >
> > Larry Severson
> > Fountain Valley, CA 92708
> > (714) 968-9852
> > larry2@...
> >
>
>
>

--
Sam Hoskins
www.MistakeProofing.Net
618-967-0016 ph.
312-212-4086 fax








------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.11/721 - Release Date: 3/13/2007 4:51 PM


Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

I am carrying a double edged folding saw to cut the glass panel under the
canopy . I think it would be hard to cut the canopy.

Peter



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
larry severson
Sent: Thursday, 29 March 2007 5:19 AM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] fire extinguishing system




if the occupants are trapped
I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It
is mounted high above/between the seats.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@socal. <mailto:larry2%40socal.rr.com> rr.com


Peter Harris <peterjfharris@...>
 

It is worth thinking about a safety installation for the Q.

If the crash remains right way up the belly tank is the most likely to be
split and in my case the fuel was spread over 20Yd and luckily did not
light up. I have an extinguisher in the cockpit now.

But the inverted crash needs something special. I was thinking maybe the
canopy should be hinged from the rear or otherwise a pop up emergency
release in the front and air pressure would blow it off if the rear securing
clips were designed right. It could then become part of the emergency list
to pop the canopy with a red handle.

Then you would lose any protection from the canopy but could get out.

Fuel running down from the inverted tanks? I suppose the source of ignition
would be somewhere in the engine compartment.

I would like to get some advice on what type of automatic extinguisher would
be safe to use in the cockpit, Halon, Co2, foam or powder and what is best
for the engine compartment?

The automatic extinguishers mostly seem to be set off by high temperature
but some can be triggered by hand and some can be remote located with a
fixed hose to the expected site.

Peter



_____

From: Q-LIST@... [mailto:Q-LIST@...] On Behalf Of
terrywadams@...
Sent: Thursday, 29 March 2007 3:18 PM
To: Q-LIST@...
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: fire extinguishing system



Thankfully my plane has a roll bar. Thankfully I had a hatchet. I went
inverted on landing once, popped the seat belt, and then broke out the
cracked canopy which allowed me to crawl out. Though the airport crash truck
arrived, if a fire had started it would have been too late to save me. JM2C

Terry

----- Original Message -----
From: Sam Hoskins
To: Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
Sent: Wednesday, March 28, 2007 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: fire extinguishing system

On my 15th flight I went inverted on the ground. The canopy smashed and I
had grass in my face. Some kind souls ran out and lifted the plane off of
me.

IMHO a hammer would do no good. I do carry a very aggressive backpacker's
saw, but I'm sure it would take 20 minutes or so to hack any kind of opening
that might do any good but I figure it's better than nothing. You would
have to go sideways and that won't be easy.

Sam

On 3/28/07, Jim Patillo <logistics_engineeri
<mailto:logistics_engineering%40msn.com> ng@...> wrote:

Larry,

Since Phil Lankford with a "K" is the only Q-Pilot I know of that
survived a serious crash in which he and his wife had gas all over them
and lived to talk about it, I thought he might be a good place to
start. I've talked with Phil at some length and we both agree
installing a crash hammer in the cockpit may create a false sense of
security. Its like pissing in the wind, its kind of fun but doesn't get
you anywhere.

1). You presume you will be conscious enough to use a hammer and 2).
that a crash hammer would even work. Have you ever tried breaking out a
rounded lexan canopy so that you know it works? Has anyone? I'm
convinced this is an area that needs to be addressed NOW by some of our
resident wizards. I love my airplane but I am very concerned about this
negative scenerio. It can happen to anyone regardless of their
abilities.

I designed my canopy with a simple quick disconnect system that allows
it to be jettisoned in a couple of seconds. This may save me in an
inflight to ground situation like Phil's but does nothing for a landing
that goes bad and inverts the plane quickly with me going unconscious.
Phil said when he was upside down, he unlatched his belt, rolled around
and got his feet on the ground and pushed the plane up and off of him
and Sherry. He didn't feel a crash hammer would have done much good.
Luckily for him, the canopy already ripped off. In fact he was very
happy the canopy was gone.

I believe the problem is serious enough, it's time we collectively came
up with a solution that would be best treated like an AD.

There have simply been to many people burned up in these planes.

Regards,
Jim Patillo

P.S. I don't express my views much anymore on this site but this one
needs to be addressed and resolved!


--- In Q-LIST@yahoogroups. <mailto:Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com> com
<Q-LIST%40yahoogroups.com>, larry severson
<larry2@...> wrote:


if the occupants are trapped
I have added a crash hammer to my Q bird minimum equipment list. It
is mounted high above/between the seats.

Larry Severson
Fountain Valley, CA 92708
(714) 968-9852
larry2@...

--
Sam Hoskins
www.MistakeProofing.Net
618-967-0016 ph.
312-212-4086 fax



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Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.11/721 - Release Date: 3/13/2007
4:51 PM


Deems Herring
 

Download AC 20-42C from the FAA web site. it has information about fire extinguishers including how to calculate the amount of Halon for a confined space. The amount needed for fire suppression is less than the amount that will cause respratory problems. I think Halon is by far the best option but needs proper engineering for installation.
Deems Herring, Baudette, MN
mailto: dsleepy47@...

----- Original Message ----
From: "JMasal@..." <JMasal@...>
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 12:02:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: fire extinguishing system

Error: the server didn't return any data for the contents of this message



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