Fw: Re: Australian builders


Rob de Bie
 

But isn't load testing a smart thing to do? I'm currently designing and building prototype UAV gliders, and we load test every flying surface of every aircraft built. We do it at room temperature though, but knowing the low Tg (glass-transition temperature) of hand-laminating epoxy systems, the Swiss requirement makes a lot of sense to me. I think load testing is worthwhile even for unmanned aircraft.

Rob

At 14:15 09-05-2013, you wrote:
The Swiss are even worse, requiring a load test for every flying surface built, and at a high temperature. I cannot remember what the test loading was, but you can take it for granted that it would be higher than anything that would be required here or in the US!

Paul B.
Cheshire
England


----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Buckley
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 1:06 AM
Subject: Fw: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders


Further to what I was saying, I helped in the construction of a Swiss registered Q-2 some years ago, using the blue foam.

The Swiss insisted on a much more stringent load testing of the flying surfaces, conducted at a heat soaked temperature of 40 deg. C (104 F) and the wing had to hold for, I believe, one minute (not just for a second or two)

It passed............ and I have a photo somewhere, I'll look it out and post it on the web site, the amount of sandbags are unbelievable!

Paul.


----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Buckley
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 12:42 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders



Well, virtually all the UK built Q's use the insulation billets as far as I know, and there has not been any problems.

I tested the peel strength myself, glassing direct onto the foam (as per plans) versus glassing onto a prepared shell of cured micro on the foam surface. This was to test the validity of glassing on top of a hard, pre-prepared surface, rather than contaminating the glass by using a wet micro slurry on the foam to lay the glass on, as per the plans.

There was no difference, the foam always tearing away first.

I know that is not what you are saying, but I don't think that the coarse cell is available now, certainly not in the UK.

I may be wrong ....... I was, once. :-)

Paul

----- Original Message -----
From: Charlie Johnson
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders

Paul and Keith,

Fine called insulation styrofoam is not the product. It has poor peel strength. Flotation logs for building marine docks orange or blue. Dow is the only company that makes styrofoam billets to my knowledge.

http://building.dow.com/na/en/products/specialty/billets.htm

There should be a marine supply near a port that stocks them.

Regards,

Charlie Johnson
Ogden, Utah

Sent from my iPad

On May 8, 2013, at 5:02 PM, "Paul Buckley" <paulbuckley@...> wrote:

Yes, that is correct.

The blue foam is made by Dow Chemicals and they sell it as
insulation for buildings.

Easily available here in the UK from a company called 'Sheffield
Insulation' .......... there must be similar firms in Oz.

Paul Buckley.


----- Original Message -----
From: John Cartledge
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 11:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders



Hi again Keith,
I remember now that the original supplied billets of this
polystyrene foam were an orange colour but later they were a blue with a finer cell structure.
Start with Dow. Hope this helps. John

Sent from my iPad

On 08/05/2013, at 9:22 PM, "keith" <keithfowler2@...> wrote:



--- In Q-LIST@..., John Cartledge <urecomps@...> wrote:

Hi Keith,
It's a long time since I built and used this stuff but I think
it is polystyrene buoyancy foam and you get big billets of it and it is was manufactured by Dow Chemical Co.
Good luck. John Cartledge VH LOQ Q200 450 hrs

Sent from my iPad

On 08/05/2013, at 9:03 AM, "keith" <keithfowler2@...> wrote:

Hi is there any builders in Australia that can tell me where I
can buy foam for the wings and canard I am in Victoria thanks Keith

hi John
Thanks for the info your q200 looks very impressive I saw a
photo of it the 2011 temora flyin thank Keith





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Mike Perry
 

Where is it posted? Sorry I'm slow, can't find it in files or photos.

Mike

On 5/9/2013 5:15 AM, Paul Buckley wrote:

I have just posted the photo of the GU canard load test on the web
site. The foam used was the finer, blue, version.

Our regulations and restrictions here in the UK are much more
stringent than the US. Nothing is allowed to be changed from the
original without specific investigation and consent, including systems
(fuel, electric) but especially anything concerning the basic structure.

The Swiss are even worse, requiring a load test for every flying
surface built, and at a high temperature. I cannot remember what the
test loading was, but you can take it for granted that it would be
higher than anything that would be required here or in the US!

Paul B.
Cheshire
England


Paul Buckley
 

I have just posted the photo of the GU canard load test on the web site. The foam used was the finer, blue, version.

Our regulations and restrictions here in the UK are much more stringent than the US. Nothing is allowed to be changed from the original without specific investigation and consent, including systems (fuel, electric) but especially anything concerning the basic structure.

The Swiss are even worse, requiring a load test for every flying surface built, and at a high temperature. I cannot remember what the test loading was, but you can take it for granted that it would be higher than anything that would be required here or in the US!

Paul B.
Cheshire
England

----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Buckley
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 1:06 AM
Subject: Fw: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders


Further to what I was saying, I helped in the construction of a Swiss registered Q-2 some years ago, using the blue foam.

The Swiss insisted on a much more stringent load testing of the flying surfaces, conducted at a heat soaked temperature of 40 deg. C (104 F) and the wing had to hold for, I believe, one minute (not just for a second or two)

It passed............ and I have a photo somewhere, I'll look it out and post it on the web site, the amount of sandbags are unbelievable!

Paul.


----- Original Message -----
From: Paul Buckley
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 12:42 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders



Well, virtually all the UK built Q's use the insulation billets as far as I know, and there has not been any problems.

I tested the peel strength myself, glassing direct onto the foam (as per plans) versus glassing onto a prepared shell of cured micro on the foam surface. This was to test the validity of glassing on top of a hard, pre-prepared surface, rather than contaminating the glass by using a wet micro slurry on the foam to lay the glass on, as per the plans.

There was no difference, the foam always tearing away first.

I know that is not what you are saying, but I don't think that the coarse cell is available now, certainly not in the UK.

I may be wrong ....... I was, once. :-)

Paul

----- Original Message -----
From: Charlie Johnson
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2013 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders

Paul and Keith,

Fine called insulation styrofoam is not the product. It has poor peel strength. Flotation logs for building marine docks orange or blue. Dow is the only company that makes styrofoam billets to my knowledge.

http://building.dow.com/na/en/products/specialty/billets.htm

There should be a marine supply near a port that stocks them.

Regards,

Charlie Johnson
Ogden, Utah
On May 8, 2013, at 5:02 PM, "Paul Buckley" <paulbuckley@...> wrote:

Yes, that is correct.

The blue foam is made by Dow Chemicals and they sell it as insulation for buildings.

Easily available here in the UK from a company called 'Sheffield Insulation' .......... there must be similar firms in Oz.

Paul Buckley.


----- Original Message -----
From: John Cartledge
To: Q-LIST@...
Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2013 11:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Q-LIST] Re: Australian builders



Hi again Keith,
I remember now that the original supplied billets of this polystyrene foam were an orange colour but later they were a blue with a finer cell structure.
Start with Dow. Hope this helps. John

Sent from my iPad

On 08/05/2013, at 9:22 PM, "keith" <keithfowler2@...> wrote:



--- In Q-LIST@..., John Cartledge <urecomps@...> wrote:

Hi Keith,
It's a long time since I built and used this stuff but I think it is polystyrene buoyancy foam and you get big billets of it and it is was manufactured by Dow Chemical Co.
Good luck. John Cartledge VH LOQ Q200 450 hrs

Sent from my iPad

On 08/05/2013, at 9:03 AM, "keith" <keithfowler2@...> wrote:

Hi is there any builders in Australia that can tell me where I can buy foam for the wings and canard I am in Victoria thanks Keith

hi John
Thanks for the info your q200 looks very impressive I saw a photo of it the 2011 temora flyin thank Keith







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http://www.quickiebuilders.org

Yahoo! Groups Links




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