Weight of Canard and Wing


mylittlemgb@...
 

Well we are heading to the finish now and I we would like to see if we are in the window for weights. Our process for the canard and wing should have us lighter then what could be built by hand layup. So if you know the weight of your canard or wing we would love to know.

Richard
Fast Little Airplanes


Martin Skiby
 

Richard,  I have an LS canard and Wadlow main wing that do not yet have the control surfaces on them.  Would this help or are you looking for a weight of them completed and ready to mount?

Martin


mylittlemgb@...
 

Any and all info is good for us. So yes please.


Jay Scheevel
 

Here are my weights: Canard only with slot cores installed, weighed prior to installing on the airframe was 70 pounds. My wing  with trailing edges and slot cores, prior to installation was 37 pounds.

I keep revising my W&B in a spreadsheet as I add components to the airframe.  I have measured weight on the three wheels maybe 15 times since installing the gear legs several years ago. These weighings are done with or without any of the 32 individual sub-components that I treat as separate in my spreadsheet. I tweak any of the then-installed components after each weighing to match the spreadsheet weight and moment to the actual weight measured on the wheels. In this way I allocate additional weight to individual installed components until it matches each weighing. Some of this extra weight gets lumped as wing or canard including the mounting glass, fillets, fairings, elevators, ailerons, including elevator and aileron supports, torque tubes, control horns, mass-balance counterweights, nuts, bolts, etc.  At this time, with my plane  nearly finished, my spreadsheet shows the "canard" at 95 pounds, and the "main wing" at 47 pounds. So I have factored an additional 25 pounds to the canard and 10 pounds to the main wing, as installed.

By the way, my tail section is now complete and final painted. I ask people to guess the weight. The lowest guess has been 85 pounds. They are surprised when I tell them it weighs in at 32 pounds.


Cheers,
Jay Scheevel, Tri-Q, still building 


Jerry Marstall
 

Mine must be lighter than air because they are floating in air when I fly.  Put me down for "0".

On Dec 23, 2016 10:04 AM, "mylittlemgb@... [Q-LIST]" <Q-LIST@...> wrote:
 

Well we are heading to the finish now and I we would like to see if we are in the window for weights. Our process for the canard and wing should have us lighter then what could be built by hand layup. So if you know the weight of your canard or wing we would love to know.

Richard
Fast Little Airplanes



mylittlemgb@...
 

Thank you Jay,

Out of curiosity since you have the Camit engine are you having to move the battery box to the tail cone for CG? I didn't know what kind of weight gain you would get with the Camit upgrades.


Sam Hoskins
 

Not sure and I'm not near any records, but in the latest go-around for an LS canard, slot cores installed, no elevator or wheel pants, 27 pounds comes to mind.

Sam

Sent via wireless Gizmo.

On Dec 23, 2016 9:04 AM, "mylittlemgb@... [Q-LIST]" <Q-LIST@...> wrote:
 

Well we are heading to the finish now and I we would like to see if we are in the window for weights. Our process for the canard and wing should have us lighter then what could be built by hand layup. So if you know the weight of your canard or wing we would love to know.

Richard
Fast Little Airplanes


Sam Hoskins
 

Jay, what is your current EW?

Sam

Sent via wireless Gizmo.

On Dec 23, 2016 12:58 PM, "jay@... [Q-LIST]" <Q-LIST@...> wrote:
 

Here are my weights: Canard only with slot cores installed, weighed prior to installing on the airframe was 70 pounds. My wing  with trailing edges and slot cores, prior to installation was 37 pounds.

I keep revising my W&B in a spreadsheet as I add components to the airframe.  I have measured weight on the three wheels maybe 15 times since installing the gear legs several years ago. These weighings are done with or without any of the 32 individual sub-components that I treat as separate in my spreadsheet. I tweak any of the then-installed components after each weighing to match the spreadsheet weight and moment to the actual weight measured on the wheels. In this way I allocate additional weight to individual installed components until it matches each weighing. Some of this extra weight gets lumped as wing or canard including the mounting glass, fillets, fairings, elevators, ailerons, including elevator and aileron supports, torque tubes, control horns, mass-balance counterweights, nuts, bolts, etc.  At this time, with my plane  nearly finished, my spreadsheet shows the "canard" at 95 pounds, and the "main wing" at 47 pounds. So I have factored an additional 25 pounds to the canard and 10 pounds to the main wing, as installed.

By the way, my tail section is now complete and final painted. I ask people to guess the weight. The lowest guess has been 85 pounds. They are surprised when I tell them it weighs in at 32 pounds.


Cheers,
Jay Scheevel, Tri-Q, still building 


Jay Scheevel
 

Hi Sam,

Merry Christmas. My last weight was 625 pounds. I had thrown in a bunch of shot bags to account for a number of things like avionics, battery and fluids, but it was probably an underestimate. My guess at this point is I will not make my advertised minimum empty weight of 650 pounds. I will have a better estimate in a month or so, after I get the rest of the fuselage ready for paint. Will keep you posted. Everything I do seems to make it heavier...imagine that..

Cheers,
Jay


Jay Scheevel
 

Hi Richard,

Sounds like you are making good progress on your projects. Keep us posted.

Battery (or perhaps batteries) will go behind the seat-back. I intend to install at least one of the EarthX LiFePo batteries. The LiFePo are much lighter than the standard lead acid battery with better cranking power. The EarthX version LiFePo contains electronics that protects the battery from any adverse voltage situations, so it becomes very difficult to damage it under nearly any circumstance. The Jabiru is lighter than the O-200, but I have mounted it a bit farther forward using the same mount that Paul Spackman has, so the moment is about the same as the O-200.

About my engine. I actually have a Jabiru not a Camit. Although the Camit was a very close version of the Jab, and by all accounts, better. They (Camit) have now gone belly up and all of their manufacturing equipment has been repossessed and sold at auction last month. I am not sure what the future portends, but there is always the possibility of a Phoenix moment for Camit if some of that equipment ends up in the right hands.

With respect to my engine. Jabiru is still in business, so the engine is marginally supported. Basically, the Jab is a well built engine, but is not as robust as the typical LycCon, so it is not a "set it and forget it" engine. With appropriate care, the Jabiru is a solidly reliable engine.

I have made some mods to mine that will add to this reliability. The only Camit mods that I have incorporated are as follows: I replaced the early hydraulic lifters (original in my engine) with solid lifters and associated rockers, bushings and pushrods...all Camit. I also installed Camit's thermostatically controlled oil cooler attachment. This replaces the Jabiru one, which has unregulated flow to the oil cooler. The thermostat mod should allow the engine oil to heat to operating temp faster.

The other mods that I have added are all made by Rotec Aerosport (the Aussie company that makes the radial engines). The most significant Rotec mod is the liquid cooled heads mod. If you recall the Voyager (round the world rutan aircraft), it had a one of a kind Continental IOL-200 engine on the rear with specially made liquid cooled heads. The Rotec design is similar to that, inasmuch as the cooling is only in the head itself, not the entire cylinder. The barrels remain air cooled. I have replaced the original Bing carburetor with Rotec's throttle body injector (TBI). That is significantly simpler than the Bing and allows for simpler, more direct mixture control. The overall size of the TBI, also allows me to have essentially a flat firewall. The third mod is to replace the fixed magnet generator/alternator that is integral with the flywheel in the Jab (nominally 17-amps). This is removed entirely and replaced with a more "conventional" belt driven alternator. This Rotec mod comes with a 40-amp automotive alternator. I decided I did not like the integral regulator in the Rotec supplied Chinese alternator, so I bought a B&C alternator of the same size and the B&C regulator to go along with it. I have installed the regulator on the interior side of the firewall to keep it cooler. The overall effect of my mods, once you consider the radiators, hoses, ducting, coolant, brackets, etc. adds about 10 pounds to the overall installation. All up, the engine with everything is about 194 pounds, as opposed to 184 in the original configuration.

Cheers,
Jay


Jim Patillo
 

Remember what Burt said........"if you throw it up and it comes back down it's to heavy. My Q200/0200 weighs 740 lbs but it has a lot of "extras" that added weight. Doesn't seem to affect the performance much tho. Still a blast!

Daily Driver
Jim Patillo
N46JP Q200


Jay Scheevel
 

I copied some of your "extras" Jim. Also, tossed the gascolator up and it came back down so I left it off.

Cheers,
Jay