2020 vendors


 

Ok everyone. It's 2020, and I'm having a hard time finding suppliers for blue XPS Foam. Building supply companies maybe? online pages are all advertising for EPS foam, since it is actually better for docks. The plans call for 2 billets 10"x20"x96" right? Is there a better way to order billets? Smaller sizes are a little easier to find but what about gluing more blocks together? Bad news? Even aircraft spruce only sells 8" thick billets now. HELP


Bruce McCormack
 

On 23Oct, 2020, at 21:22, Cody <cody.craig1985@...> wrote:

Ok everyone. It's 2020, and I'm having a hard time finding suppliers for blue XPS Foam. Building supply companies maybe? online pages are all advertising for EPS foam, since it is actually better for docks. The plans call for 2 billets 10"x20"x96" right? Is there a better way to order billets? Smaller sizes are a little easier to find but what about gluing more blocks together? Bad news? Even aircraft spruce only sells 8" thick billets now. HELP


Bruce Crain
 

The plans show BL (butt line) lengths.  Each template sits at those buttons lines.  Look at the plans and the directions show how long the individual foam cores are by butt lines.  You will need to build a table that is flat and level.  Then read how to cut the foam cores by the level lines being lined up level and set up for sweep back.
Use only the blue styrofoam as there are foams that give off a cyanate poison gas. 
Read and re-read.  
Do you have the directions for building the LS1 with the carbon fiber spar?
Bruce


On Oct 23, 2020, at 10:10 PM, Bruce McCormack <bob2@...> wrote:


May come down to geography and shipping
Dow Styrofoam Buoyancy Billets 7" x 20" x 8' (Supports 425 lbs.) -- Ring's End





On 23Oct, 2020, at 21:22, Cody <cody.craig1985@...> wrote:

Ok everyone. It's 2020, and I'm having a hard time finding suppliers for blue XPS Foam. Building supply companies maybe? online pages are all advertising for EPS foam, since it is actually better for docks. The plans call for 2 billets 10"x20"x96" right? Is there a better way to order billets? Smaller sizes are a little easier to find but what about gluing more blocks together? Bad news? Even aircraft spruce only sells 8" thick billets now. HELP




One Sky Dog
 

I do not know but are the ten inch billets so you could get more cores out of one billet?

Do not glue blocks together horizontally people did and died.

Buy more billets to make cores one piece per plan if required. If you are worried about the cost of extra foam hmmm?

Falling out of the sky in a broken machine is not a fun day.

Regards,

On Oct 23, 2020, at 7:23 PM, Cody <cody.craig1985@...> wrote:

Ok everyone. It's 2020, and I'm having a hard time finding suppliers for blue XPS Foam. Building supply companies maybe? online pages are all advertising for EPS foam, since it is actually better for docks. The plans call for 2 billets 10"x20"x96" right? Is there a better way to order billets? Smaller sizes are a little easier to find but what about gluing more blocks together? Bad news? Even aircraft spruce only sells 8" thick billets now. HELP


Dan Moses
 

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 10:40 AM, One Sky Dog wrote:
Do not glue blocks together horizontally people did and died.
I do not doubt the truth of this statement, but please elaborate. From a model aviation composites background, this is not an obvious blunder.  Isn’t the foam designed to only take compressional forces?  I’m all for following instructions to the letter, but one of the justifications for amateur aviation is education.  Can you help me understand what some unfortunates learned the hard way?


 

I was actually planning on following Sams tutorial on quickheads. I especially like the photos, they seem to help more than the hand drawings sometimes.


Michael
 

Cody,

Try reaching out to Jon Matcho on www.canardzone.com (preferred) or here. My bet is that searching on that site will get you some answers, since the Long-EZ folks are in the same boat when trying to source materials for a 40+ year old kit. There are also some old threads here on the Q-List about the same topic (try searching 'flotation billet' or 'pipe billet').

Sorry I can't offer more help, but I'm rootin' for ya'!
--
-MD
#2827 (still thinking about planning on visualizing how to finish building)


One Sky Dog
 

Shear forces go through the foam trying to glue sheets together builds in a change in stiffness and loads always concentrate in stiffness changes.

On Oct 24, 2020, at 10:47 AM, Dan Moses via groups.io <r90s@...> wrote:

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 10:40 AM, One Sky Dog wrote:
Do not glue blocks together horizontally people did and died.
I do not doubt the truth of this statement, but please elaborate. From a model aviation composites background, this is not an obvious blunder.  Isn’t the foam designed to only take compressional forces?  I’m all for following instructions to the letter, but one of the justifications for amateur aviation is education.  Can you help me understand what some unfortunates learned the hard way?


Sam Hoskins
 


On Fri, Oct 23, 2020, 9:23 PM Cody <cody.craig1985@...> wrote:
Ok everyone. It's 2020, and I'm having a hard time finding suppliers for blue XPS Foam. Building supply companies maybe? online pages are all advertising for EPS foam, since it is actually better for docks. The plans call for 2 billets 10"x20"x96" right? Is there a better way to order billets? Smaller sizes are a little easier to find but what about gluing more blocks together? Bad news? Even aircraft spruce only sells 8" thick billets now. HELP


Jay Scheevel
 

...causing the foam to fail at the glued interface, followed by catastrophic delamination....

Finished it for you, Charlie. Hope you don't mind.

Cheers,
Jay

Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID


"One Sky Dog via groups.io" <Oneskydog@...> wrote:

Shear forces go through the foam trying to glue sheets together builds in a change in stiffness and loads always concentrate in stiffness changes.

On Oct 24, 2020, at 10:47 AM, Dan Moses via groups.io <r90s@...> wrote:

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 10:40 AM, One Sky Dog wrote:
Do not glue blocks together horizontally people did and died.
I do not doubt the truth of this statement, but please elaborate. From a model aviation composites background, this is not an obvious blunder.  Isn’t the foam designed to only take compressional forces?  I’m all for following instructions to the letter, but one of the justifications for amateur aviation is education.  Can you help me understand what some unfortunates learned the hard way?


Brian Hutchinson
 

No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


Mike Dwyer
 


On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


Brian Larick
 

What is the difference between the current Dow Blue foam blocks and the original kit orange blocks?

Brian

On Oct 25, 2020, at 18:12, Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:


On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


Bruce McCormack
 

The story way back was that the color change was to make it less attractive to beavers who attacked docks.

On 25Oct, 2020, at 17:39, Brian Larick <blarick@...> wrote:

What is the difference between the current Dow Blue foam blocks and the original kit orange blocks?

Brian

On Oct 25, 2020, at 18:12, Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:


On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.




Sam Hoskins
 

Close, but that Tommydock stuff is in 48" blocks and we need 50"sections. It's the right material though.

The big billets are out there, these newbies just need to dig a little deeper.

Sam

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 5:12 PM Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


Jay Scheevel
 

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sam Hoskins
Sent: Sunday, October 25, 2020 6:16 PM
To: Main@q-list.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] 2020 vendors

 

Close, but that Tommydock stuff is in 48" blocks and we need 50"sections. It's the right material though.

 

The big billets are out there, these newbies just need to dig a little deeper.

 

Sam

 

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 5:12 PM Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:

 

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


Mike Dwyer
 

The orange had much bigger air pockets that sucked up more micro to fill.  My kit came with the blue, but my buddies was orange.  We hotwired both and they cut the same.  I like the blue!
Mike Dwyer

Q200 Website: http://goo.gl/V8IrJF


On Sun, Oct 25, 2020 at 6:39 PM Brian Larick <blarick@...> wrote:
What is the difference between the current Dow Blue foam blocks and the original kit orange blocks?

Brian

On Oct 25, 2020, at 18:12, Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:


On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


Corbin
 

No stock.  I don’t think they have had for a while.

Corbin

On Oct 25, 2020, at 7:37 PM, Jay Scheevel <jay@...> wrote:



What is wrong with using the original material/source?

 

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pnpages/01-01166.php?msclkid=f67805ef78e7169a70e85a79613005e5&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=TNT%20-%20Shopping%20-%20BR%20-%20Desktop&utm_term=4580634161251749&utm_content=All%20Products

 

Cheers,

Jay

 

From: main@Q-List.groups.io <main@Q-List.groups.io> On Behalf Of Sam Hoskins
Sent: Sunday, October 25, 2020 6:16 PM
To: Main@q-list.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Q-List] 2020 vendors

 

Close, but that Tommydock stuff is in 48" blocks and we need 50"sections. It's the right material though.

 

The big billets are out there, these newbies just need to dig a little deeper.

 

Sam

 

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 5:12 PM Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:

 

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


--

Corbin 
N33QR


Brad Walker
 

I've always found a phone call directly to Dow sales support will be helpful.. They can tell you who the local distributor is.

-brad w.

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020 at 6:16 PM Sam Hoskins <sam.hoskins@...> wrote:
Close, but that Tommydock stuff is in 48" blocks and we need 50"sections. It's the right material though.

The big billets are out there, these newbies just need to dig a little deeper.

Sam

On Sun, Oct 25, 2020, 5:12 PM Mike Dwyer <q200pilot@...> wrote:

On Sat, Oct 24, 2020 at 11:22 PM Brian Hutchinson via groups.io <brianmh13=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
No recommendation from me for foam. Thanks for bringing up the matter of forces in the foam. I had watched a video on Metallurgy the other day considering the crystalline structure and it was said the forces move through the metal in a way that is similar to the way described here. Though I don't think the foam experiences true shear load (90 degree to the upper and lower surfaces) the forces wound think are variable and related to amount of deflection of wing tip to root. Vertically laminated seems the best way to join foam blocks I agree. These are the "little" considerations that have big effects and are what needs to be discussed in my opinion more important than enduring debates on why auto conversion engines are the devil and such.


 

I have a flat table. Started making the jigs for mounting.